White Pride/White Nationalism vs. Racism

These concepts are socially constructed and have been given much weight. What are your thoughts?
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White Pride/White Nationalism vs. Racism

Unread post by Common Sense » September 3rd, 2004, 2:27 am

I have had my share of debates this summer with many White Nationalist. I feel white pride is good, just like black pride, latin pride, and gay pride. People should be proud of their racial heritage. No one chose to be who they are. You accept what was given to you.

My issues start with people who go beyond being prideful to racist. Pride and racism are two different ideologies. When a person take their pride to a level of superiority and then start putting someone else down over their racial heritage is a blatant racist, and deserves no respect. Some people start to blend racial pride with racial hate. Thats when we start to have problems in the world.

I had the priviledge to box on Storm Front for a couple of weeks. I couldn't believe how ignorant some of those fools are. I had to give out many D minus grades for History. Some of these characters selectively record history in their mnds to benefit their distorted causes.

The one thing that puzzles me the most about White Nationalist is their obsession with Hitler. What puzzles me even more is Americans and British citizens obsessions with Hitler. I feel any North American and British person throwing up the "seig heil" should be tarred and feathered especially after Germany practically had the UK on it's knees.

I had many tell me how their relative that fought in WW2 confessed later that they were fighting on the wrong side and should have defending Nazi Germany. What a crock of crap. They had the chance to defect if it were true.

This holds true for black nationalist as well. Black pride is good, but when every white person you meet is "The blue eyed devil", then were back to the same ignorant thinking like the WN.

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Re: White Pride/White Nationalism vs. Racism

Unread post by Common Sense » September 4th, 2004, 1:57 pm

To Tron:

RE: Skinheads

Arent the Skins trying to advanced their race, by stepping on other peoples neck?

How are the skins educating the community that's not based on hate?

Are the Skins not in for selfish reasons too? Most law abiding people in the community don't buy the Skinhead philosophy.

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Re: White Pride/White Nationalism vs. Racism

Unread post by shadoworder » September 5th, 2004, 9:37 pm

Common Sense wrote:I have had my share of debates this summer with many White Nationalist. I feel white pride is good, just like black pride, latin pride, and gay pride. People should be proud of their racial heritage. No one chose to be who they are. You accept what was given to you.

My issues start with people who go beyond being prideful to racist. Pride and racism are two different ideologies. When a person take their pride to a level of superiority and then start putting someone else down over their racial heritage is a blatant racist, and deserves no respect. Some people start to blend racial pride with racial hate. Thats when we start to have problems in the world.

I had the priviledge to box on Storm Front for a couple of weeks. I couldn't believe how ignorant some of those fools are. I had to give out many D minus grades for History. Some of these characters selectively record history in their mnds to benefit their distorted causes.

The one thing that puzzles me the most about White Nationalist is their obsession with Hitler. What puzzles me even more is Americans and British citizens obsessions with Hitler. I feel any North American and British person throwing up the "seig heil" should be tarred and feathered especially after Germany practically had the UK on it's knees.

I had many tell me how their relative that fought in WW2 confessed later that they were fighting on the wrong side and should have defending Nazi Germany. What a crock of crap. They had the chance to defect if it were true.

This holds true for black nationalist as well. Black pride is good, but when every white person you meet is "The blue eyed devil", then were back to the same ignorant thinking like the WN.
i agree with a lot of what you said,however,the big difference is that any manifestation of white pride,is shouted down as "hate"even if its something like being against illegal immigration.and the majority of the time it s leftwing whites who are doing it.how often do you see or hear blacks attacking black nationalists??it happens,but not with the same venom and ferocity that white liberals do with their own.keep in mind that the reason so many kids turn to nazism,is because they are the only ones talking about white rights,no one else wants to deal with that,so who are they supposed to turn to??if their was a white equivalant to the naacp,or the adl,a lot of these skins would probaly follow that.but nobody wants to deal with that,they ignore racial double standards,and then act shocked when they shave their heads and get swastika tatts.also how far do you go with your definition of "pride"??im sure you dont have a problem with someone saying im proud to be white,but what about someone saying they prefer to date within their own race,is that pride or hate??or someone saying that they prefer to live amongst people who are similar to themselves racially and culturally, pride or hate?,as for stormfront,i think if you look at the board as a whole,youll find that the socalled white power movement is far from unified on ideology,also ,out of curiousity,what name did you go under when you were challenging people on the stormfront board??im curious,because,most of the time when antiracists go on the board,they rarely try to debate things civilly,and when they do,and the racists start to destroy the argumenst of the antis,the antis resort to namecalling and insults,and are never seen and heard from again.ive seen that time and time again,im not saying you yourself did that,but id like to see if you did as well as you claim.people differ on a lot of things on stormfront,one thing is this hitler worship,its is total bulshit to imply that everyone is obsessed with hitler,their are a lot of people who are contemptous of nazism on that board,but are still prowhite.for the record,white nationalists are people who believe in racial pride,but also believe in democracy,not fascism,but who dont believe that democracy has to be synonomous with multiculturaism.a lot of WN are pro-jewish,and consider a significant portion of the jews to be a part of the white race too.nazis are the ones who hate everyone,including large portions of the white race,who arent white enough for them,and who think the holocaust is fake,and all that nonsense.

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Re: White Pride/White Nationalism vs. Racism

Unread post by Loyalheart » October 15th, 2004, 9:34 pm

^^the truth^^

I'm proud to be white and when i say this to friends i always get a funny look like i've just screamed heil hitler. Like you say shadowoeder young white's don't have a way of of celebrating there culture and there race, and thats when they get sucked into supremicist groups.The change in attitudes to white people as being weak and demonised only helps the supremicist groups recruit young nieve kids.It's a shame but as long as the politicaly correct left have control the supremicist groups will get more powerfull as time goes on




SO SURRENDER

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Re: White Pride/White Nationalism vs. Racism

Unread post by Kemosave » October 16th, 2004, 1:51 pm

CommonSense, are you sitting there with a straight face comparing lifestyle choices to race?

I don't see that. A guy of such low moral character that he would stick his thing in another man or visa versa is a different situation and should be viewed differently than someone's racial makeup.

Man if you have been brainwashed that bad by the media then you are going to have to extend all lifestyles the same courtesy no matter what they are. From people who think they are vampires to animal "lovers", and that's a repugnant idea too, in order for your logic to wash.

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Re: White Pride/White Nationalism vs. Racism

Unread post by WillieCreeper » October 22nd, 2004, 4:12 pm

Kemosave, your argument is crap. If you are going to extend respect to homosexuals, it doesn't mean you have to extend respect (or legality) to vampires any other crazy crap.

You should think harder before forming your opinion. Just because we don't throw people in jail for killing someone in defense does not imply that we shouldn't imprison people who commit mass murder because they think it's fun.

You have been brainwashed by a lack of reason my friend.

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Re: White Pride/White Nationalism vs. Racism

Unread post by WillieCreeper » October 22nd, 2004, 4:18 pm

As for you 'white pride' people, fine, there's a double standard. For example, it's OK for this society to sh*t all over Native American identity, but it's not OK to do the same to any other group. The Washington lynchers? The Cleveland Whiteys?

So before you start getting all sorry for yourself, you need to realize that your ancestors came to this country and killed the people who were here before - not your fault, and not unique to the white race. But we leech off of other countries, and then complain when people want to come into the US illegally.

So a lot of people have it a lot harder than you. And if you're still so concerned with race, OK, I think you're wasting your time.

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Re: White Pride/White Nationalism vs. Racism

Unread post by Conman » October 22nd, 2004, 4:34 pm

Common Sense wrote:I have had my share of debates this summer with many White Nationalist. I feel white pride is good, just like black pride, latin pride, and gay pride.
^^WTF are you talking about???
Common Sense wrote:People should be proud of their racial heritage.
^^I completely agree.
Common Sense wrote:No one chose to be who they are. You accept what was given to you.
^^Again, I agree...no one chose who they are....but you do choose where to stick you dick.

I do not and will not accept the comparison of being Black or any other race to being a fag...Fags choose their lifestyle..get it...lifestyle. Last I knew, race was something you were born with????

Kemosave wrote: CommonSense, are you sitting there with a straight face comparing lifestyle choices to race?
^^That is what I am saying...CS is on one.

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Re: White Pride/White Nationalism vs. Racism

Unread post by Midwest Honey » October 22nd, 2004, 8:37 pm

Whoa, this is kinda strange, because I have just actually started researching some stuff on White and Black Nationalism. And ironically I too have checked out stromfront and are amazed by their ignorance.

They post up articles if a minority does something wrong in the world, like if a women if raped or murdered by a black men. I guess they think white men don't rape or murder women though.

As to the question, from what I saw these people don't have pride in their race without showing there racism and racist views.



Anyway, that's my thoughts on the matter. And it's sick how they are brainwashing other young white children to believe all the fairytale BS they pull out of their ass.

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Re: White Pride/White Nationalism vs. Racism

Unread post by Common Sense » October 23rd, 2004, 12:38 am

Kemosave wrote:CommonSense, are you sitting there with a straight face comparing lifestyle choices to race?
No.....not at all. Maybe that didn't come out right. My point was, most people are proud of who they are. Most gay's are proud of who they are too, whether we agree with their lifestyle or not. Some say they were born that way, some say not. I don't know and frankly it's none of my business. My motto: Repect me and I will respect you.

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Re: White Pride/White Nationalism vs. Racism

Unread post by Kemosave » October 23rd, 2004, 2:30 pm

WillieCreeper wrote:Kemosave, your argument is crap. If you are going to extend respect to homosexuals, it doesn't mean you have to extend respect (or legality) to vampires any other crazy crap.

You should think harder before forming your opinion. Just because we don't throw people in jail for killing someone in defense does not imply that we shouldn't imprison people who commit mass murder because they think it's fun.

You have been brainwashed by a lack of reason my friend.
Not at all. But you may have been. Or perhaps you are just a defensive homosexual? Either way if you extend the types of civil rights which have traditionally been implemented for people of color (who cannot change their color) to people who make sexual choices with their body and then decide they want to hijack those rights for themselves then you have taken a left turn. Maybe you should think harder so you can comprehend that simple truth. Perhaps then you won't be such an ardent supporter of gay rights.
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Re: White Pride/White Nationalism vs. Racism

Unread post by Kemosave » October 23rd, 2004, 2:33 pm

Common Sense wrote:
Kemosave wrote:CommonSense, are you sitting there with a straight face comparing lifestyle choices to race?
No.....not at all. Maybe that didn't come out right. My point was, most people are proud of who they are. Most gay's are proud of who they are too, whether we agree with their lifestyle or not. Some say they were born that way, some say not. I don't know and frankly it's none of my business. My motto: Repect me and I will respect you.
Well sure. Manson was very proud of himself too. So is Marilyn Manson for that matter. So was Hitler. So was the guy dying of aids in San Francisco in the 70's that began calling for homosexuals to infect straight people to get the focus off it being a "homosexual" disease. I'm not saying anything untrue. What's your point? If Manson respects you then you respect him?

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Re: White Pride/White Nationalism vs. Racism

Unread post by Common Sense » October 23rd, 2004, 3:15 pm

Kemosave wrote:What's your point? If Manson respects you then you respect him?
Let's not mix apples with oranges Kemosave.
My point being: law abiding citizen's. I don't have an issue with law abiding gay people. Their lifestyle is their business as far as I'm concerned.

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Re: White Pride/White Nationalism vs. Racism

Unread post by Common Sense » October 23rd, 2004, 3:23 pm

**I feel white pride is good, just like black pride, latin pride, and gay pride. ***

This statement means be proud of who you are (ethnically) and what you are (personal life style choice).

We as society may not agree with personal choices of some, but maybe it's not our choice to make for other people?

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Re: White Pride/White Nationalism vs. Racism

Unread post by Red Rum56 » October 23rd, 2004, 7:32 pm

Arent the Skins trying to advanced their race, by stepping on other peoples neck?

No we just want to seperate so we won't run into this situation.

How are the skins educating the community that's not based on hate?

We do flyer distribuation and go to mettings.

Are the Skins not in for selfish reasons too? Most law abiding people in the community don't buy the Skinhead philosophy.

First off, what do you mean by "WN's" do you mean all WN's or skinheads? Because I am a National Socialist.you could know that I am NS just by looking at me.
I don't think that "many young WN's feel the need to wear mostly black, shave their heads, get tatoos"...now if you mean skinheads that is different.
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Re: White Pride/White Nationalism vs. Racism

Unread post by Common Sense » October 24th, 2004, 8:33 am

Snake wrote:No we just want to seperate so we won't run into this situation..
How can you separate? WN's and NS are dependant on everyone else just like everybody else. Even WN gangs in prison are dependant upon some hispanic groups. If WN's were able to totally separate, I don't think you guys would make it.

Snake wrote:We do flyer distribuation and go to mettings..
Okay.
Snake wrote:First off, what do you mean by "WN's" do you mean all WN's or skinheads? Because I am a National Socialist, and there is no way in hell you could know that I am NS just by looking at me.
I don't think that "many young WN's feel the need to wear mostly black, shave their heads, get tatoos"...now if you mean skinheads that is different.
Okay. What would be interesting......is to know what crossed you over? Were you raised in a WN family? Did you get in a scuffle with non whites?
Were you having a low period in your life and was recruited? What was it? I know it was something significant.

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Re: White Pride/White Nationalism vs. Racism

Unread post by Red Rum56 » October 24th, 2004, 1:40 pm

How can you separate? WN's and NS are dependant on everyone else just like everybody else. Even WN gangs in prison are dependant upon some hispanic groups. If WN's were able to totally separate, I don't think you guys would make it.

http://www.aryan-nations.org/ I think we could. We done it for million of year in Euope.

Okay. What would be interesting......is to know what crossed you over? Were you raised in a WN family? Did you get in a scuffle with non whites?
Were you having a low period in your life and was recruited? What was it? I know it was something significant.

My family is 100% non racist. I got my hate for other races in the second one. I got into the last after experemeting with hard drugs and the life of crime with non whites. It seemed like the most nobal thing to do after I screwed up so much. I still have problems with drugs and still get beat down by wiggers and non whites but at least I have pride in myself.

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Re: White Pride/White Nationalism vs. Racism

Unread post by Common Sense » October 24th, 2004, 2:38 pm

Snake wrote:I think we could. We done it for million of year in Euope..
Some of the people of Europe come from tribes all over. Especially the Angles and Saxon's.
Snake wrote:My family is 100% non racist..
Well..... good for them, but something went very wrong in the family bond for you to turn to drugs, crime, and now extremism.
Snake wrote:I got my hate for other races in the second one..
That's usually the case sometimes.
Snake wrote:I got into the last after experemeting with hard drugs and the life of crime with non whites. It seemed like the most nobal thing to do after I screwed up so much..

I understand what you are trying to say, but this way is not noble or the best thing you can do. It's just another problem you don't need...only to extend the misery.
Snake wrote:I still have problems with drugs and still get beat down by wiggers and non whites but at least I have pride in myself.
Take more pride in yourself. Find some real help for your problems. Drugs can really be a dangerous gateway to death. If you don't look the part (NS), then the only thing I can understand why you are getting beat down is.......you must be saying something to bring attention to yourself in a negative way.
Snake....there is a better way to live. Give it some thought.

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Re: White Pride/White Nationalism vs. Racism

Unread post by Red Rum56 » October 24th, 2004, 4:52 pm

Well I kind of do look the part, I wear alot of black, combat boots and all that but im just saying that most yoaths with my views of not skinhead, they are good kids. I just took a differnt path in my views then they did. Most real nazi probly would not approve of me. But I think what im doing is better then when I was hanging out with non whites because I've been around them long enough to know what they are about.

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Re: White Pride/White Nationalism vs. Racism

Unread post by Common Sense » October 24th, 2004, 5:32 pm

Snake wrote:But I think what im doing is better then when I was hanging out with non whites because I've been around them long enough to know what they are about.
Maybe it was those particular non whites that weren't good for you. Every group has dogs that run within their ranks, even whites. You should consider not trading one bad group for another. You have to associate yourself with cool people period.

You don't need anyone to accept you to be cool. You can be your own man, and do that.

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Re: White Pride/White Nationalism vs. Racism

Unread post by shadoworder » October 25th, 2004, 5:10 am

WillieCreeper wrote:As for you 'white pride' people, fine, there's a double standard. For example, it's OK for this society to sh*t all over Native American identity, but it's not OK to do the same to any other group. The Washington lynchers? The Cleveland Whiteys?

So before you start getting all sorry for yourself, you need to realize that your ancestors came to this country and killed the people who were here before - not your fault, and not unique to the white race. But we leech off of other countries, and then complain when people want to come into the US illegally.

So a lot of people have it a lot harder than you. And if you're still so concerned with race, OK, I think you're wasting your time.
my ancestors came here,fought a war,and conquered this country,we didnt steal it.just like the ancestors of the first native americans who arrived in the americas after crossing the berring strait,fought and conquered those who were here already.probaly every country that has ever existed was founded in the same manner.
why shouldnt people complain about illegal aliens??do you think we should just have open borders??i will say this,i think people who are against illegals,but only attack the illegals are way off the mark,who they should be going after are the businesses who hire these people,even though it is against the law to do so.

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Re: White Pride/White Nationalism vs. Racism

Unread post by WillieCreeper » October 25th, 2004, 11:06 am

I don't think we should have open borders. But what people who post here don't understand (and most people don't understand) is that nothing is completely black or white, right or wrong. We need appropriate POLICY to handle America's problems with immigration. But if we don't understand the roots of the turmoil in the world, how can we formulate appropriate policy? And once you do understand those roots, you realize that things are more complicated than they seem. The answer is not simply white power and gay bashing, and lynching Hispanics when they come into the country.

As for Kemosave and you other anti-gay fools, so what if I'm homosexual as you imply? Are you trying to degrade me by labeling me? That's weak, because my sexuality doesn't matter to the argument I'm making. Furthermore, how can you sit there and say that homosexuality is a choice. Please, post your Phd in biology on the forum since you know so much about the genetics of sexual preference.

And explain exactly what you mean when you say that gays will 'hijack' the system if given rights. In what way? Even if you don't agree with someone being homosexual doesn't mean that you can persecute them. If that's what you think, then you're just the strangest kind of neo-nazi - only down with people who fit your mold, and unwilling to understand that in America, no one should have to care about your religious beliefs - it's called separation of church and state homie.

I love the fact that the very people who fought and died for their civil rights are the first ones to turn around and want to screw the next guy in the ass. Between the gangs and your backward politics, believe me, the people in power are laughing at you, because you're doing the dirty work for them.

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Re: White Pride/White Nationalism vs. Racism

Unread post by WillieCreeper » October 25th, 2004, 11:19 am

shadoworder wrote: my ancestors came here,fought a war,and conquered this country,we didnt steal it.just like the ancestors of the first native americans who arrived in the americas after crossing the berring strait,fought and conquered those who were here already.probaly every country that has ever existed was founded in the same manner.
why shouldnt people complain about illegal aliens??do you think we should just have open borders??i will say this,i think people who are against illegals,but only attack the illegals are way off the mark,who they should be going after are the businesses who hire these people,even though it is against the law to do so.
shadoworder - I didn't use the quote 'steal.' In fact, I said almost exactly what you said in your quote above. You need to stop putting words in people's mouths and trying to create stereotypes that are easy to defeat. Otherwise, you can't learn anything and you'll always confirm your own views.

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Re: White Pride/White Nationalism vs. Racism

Unread post by Conman » October 26th, 2004, 5:46 pm

WillieCreeper wrote:As for Kemosave and you other anti-gay fools, so what if I'm homosexual as you imply? Are you trying to degrade me by labeling me? That's weak, because my sexuality doesn't matter to the argument I'm making.
I guess my previous post makes me one of those fools you are referring to. Well I am no fool...no need for name calling I did not call you one unless my use of the word fag offended you. I am not trying to degrade you or label you. And you are right, YOUR sexuality does not matter.
WillieCreeper wrote:Furthermore, how can you sit there and say that homosexuality is a choice.
If this behavior is a part of nature as a whole then where are the gay birds, dogs, cats, bears, monkeys, apes etc.?

Now if that sounds crazy then why is it that the vast majority of gays...male and female have engaged and continue to engage in heterosexual acts? Why do so many fags act feminine? Why do so many dykes/lesbians (the pretty feminine ones I adore) shave their heads, take hormones and grow face and chest hair? Why do fags have sex changes to become women only to be with men??? Before I start sounding like Jadakiss...this is a behavior and actions that are chosen..

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Re: White Pride/White Nationalism vs. Racism

Unread post by WillieCreeper » October 27th, 2004, 9:26 am

Conman - no dis intended. I appreciate your post.

Here's what I think. Yes, you're right, there are no gay birds. But I think it's true that there are certain species of monkeys that perform homosexual acts. It could be that down the genetic line we are a part of, homosexuality is indeed genetic.

All I'm trying to say is that we don't know if it's as simple as being a choice. True, someone who is gay can choose not to act on those impulses, if that's what you mean. But regardless of whether it is genetic, or choice, or a combination, people everywhere deserve the same level of respect no matter what they do. The point is actually that it doesn't matter if it's a choice or not. People who want to ban gay marraige, for example, want to do that on religious grounds. But separation of church and state is a basic tenet of our constitution, and so you can't deny people that, even if it is a choice.

I just think it's a shame that we as a society have such trouble standing up for the civil rights of others, given our past history. We always make some excuse like "black people are genetically inferior" or "gay people made a choice." My point is that both of those statements are irrelevant.

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Re: White Pride/White Nationalism vs. Racism

Unread post by Conman » October 27th, 2004, 6:09 pm

My overall point is this --- There is no correlation between being Black and being a fag...

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no it is not

Unread post by Mraka » December 25th, 2004, 11:55 am

I`am siting and reading,following the passage of being proud to be white....hahahahahhah
Just leave everything alone with this thinking till you get 30 or something otherwise you can really harm society. If you for ex. swim 25 kilometers and you want to tell everyone and it is registered and respected ,then all inclusive think that you are proud.But from my point of view through the cyber space there is no indication for who you all are, or what you do; you even might be a machine .Like you describe yourself you are just a person of white colour skin and no albino but caucasian.I thank you former for taking this huge step back behind your lines of beeing a white guy,because I never again whant to have something to do with that kind of poeple.They never done nothing but harm!!!I repeat for the younger ones.The "I`am proud of my race poeple";are good for nothing.!
If you want to close your borders:Than don`t even get out of their.Stay at "Home"!
The gay thing was, what I didn`t understand.I can tell you that it was a big medical company spreading AIDS to asia knowing the risc.
At least :An organisation that is build up by men ,run by men ,and then making everybody ugly how "ungay" is it.
This aryan are the least IQ poeple I ever heard of.No,the poeple I rose up with were worse. :evil:
try http://www.crna-legija.net

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Mraka
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false link /sorry but simmillar

Unread post by Mraka » December 25th, 2004, 11:57 am

link is incorrect sorry
go4
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crna legija
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