Structure

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Elimu
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Structure

Unread post by Elimu » November 5th, 2009, 9:05 am

Which seem more effective & difficult to take down a tight-knit OC syndicate or loose-knit OC syndicate?

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Re: Structure

Unread post by thewestside » November 5th, 2009, 3:47 pm

Elimu wrote:Which seem more effective & difficult to take down a tight-knit OC syndicate or loose-knit OC syndicate?
Both have their strengths and weaknesses. A more formal, hierarchial structure presents a more definitive target for law enforcement while a descentralized, fluid structure is harder to pin down. On the other hand, the more formal, hierarchial groups have a greater ability to reorganize and continue on after they get hit because they have an organization in place, whereas an indictment will further disrupt the lesser organized groups because there isn't any kind of system in place to regroup.

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Re: Structure

Unread post by Elimu » November 6th, 2009, 8:13 am

thewestside wrote:
Elimu wrote:Which seem more effective & difficult to take down a tight-knit OC syndicate or loose-knit OC syndicate?
I asked you another question in a diffrent topic; Who's the most organized syndicated and why does their hierarchy/structure intrigued you?
Both have their strengths and weaknesses. A more formal, hierarchial structure presents a more definitive target for law enforcement while a descentralized, fluid structure is harder to pin down. On the other hand, the more formal, hierarchial groups have a greater ability to reorganize and continue on after they get hit because they have an organization in place, whereas an indictment will further disrupt the lesser organized groups because there isn't any kind of system in place to regroup.

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Re: Structure

Unread post by thewestside » November 6th, 2009, 9:29 am

Elimu wrote:I asked you another question in a diffrent topic; Who's the most organized syndicated and why does their hierarchy/structure intrigued you?
If by "most organized" you mean the most hierachial, there are more than a few that could claim that. The Sicilian Mafia for one. The Sun Yee On Triad for another. I mention those two as examples because the Sicilians are more hierarchial than their Calabrian cousins in the 'Ndrangheta or their Neopolitan cousins in the Camorra. The Sun Yee On is basically the only Triad group left with the old formal structure. The rest, like 14K, etc. have become more fluid and descentralized. Russian and Albanian groups are relatively descentralized, often working in cells centered around certain operations at a given time. Russian and Japanese syndicates are similar in that they are umbrella organizations for several smaller groups under their influence and protection. By I think by "most organized" you mean the most well run. I'm not sure any one OC group could be claimed to be the most well run though obviously some are better run than others.

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Re: Structure

Unread post by Elimu » November 9th, 2009, 9:46 am

thewestside wrote:
Elimu wrote:I asked you another question in a diffrent topic; Who's the most organized syndicated and why does their hierarchy/structure intrigued you?
If by "most organized" you mean the most hierachial, there are more than a few that could claim that. The Sicilian Mafia for one. The Sun Yee On Triad for another. I mention those two as examples because the Sicilians are more hierarchial than their Calabrian cousins in the 'Ndrangheta or their Neopolitan cousins in the Camorra. The Sun Yee On is basically the only Triad group left with the old formal structure. The rest, like 14K, etc. have become more fluid and descentralized. Russian and Albanian groups are relatively descentralized, often working in cells centered around certain operations at a given time. Russian and Japanese syndicates are similar in that they are umbrella organizations for several smaller groups under their influence and protection. By I think by "most organized" you mean the most well run. I'm not sure any one OC group could be claimed to be the most well run though obviously some are better run than others.
What about certain organized street gangs? If they drop the identifiers, colors, handsigns, handshakes,etc. will they be considered to be an organized crime group? Because you already know the defintion of a OC group and street gang but the Yakuza/Triads have a symbol & tatoos to distingush themselves but their still defined as an OC group.

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Re: Structure

Unread post by thewestside » November 9th, 2009, 11:33 pm

Elimu wrote:What about certain organized street gangs? If they drop the identifiers, colors, handsigns, handshakes,etc. will they be considered to be an organized crime group? Because you already know the defintion of a OC group and street gang but the Yakuza/Triads have a symbol & tatoos to distingush themselves but their still defined as an OC group.
The identfiers, colors, handsigns, etc. are not what keep street gangs from being labeled "organized crime." The difference is usually a matter of organizational structure, sophistication of operations, and so on. But there are gangs that very much could fall under the heading of organized crime. And there are some groups which are labeled organized crime that are not much more than street gangs. Sometimes the line is a very thin one and there isn't much of a difference.

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Re: Structure

Unread post by Dobre » November 10th, 2009, 12:13 am

thewestside wrote:
Elimu wrote:What about certain organized street gangs? If they drop the identifiers, colors, handsigns, handshakes,etc. will they be considered to be an organized crime group? Because you already know the defintion of a OC group and street gang but the Yakuza/Triads have a symbol & tatoos to distingush themselves but their still defined as an OC group.
The identfiers, colors, handsigns, etc. are not what keep street gangs from being labeled "organized crime." The difference is usually a matter of organizational structure, sophistication of operations, and so on. But there are gangs that very much could fall under the heading of organized crime. And there are some groups which are labeled organized crime that are not much more than street gangs. Sometimes the line is a very thin one and there isn't much of a difference.
Except the influence. Ironically, a typical leader of a large American street gang would rather live the life that the rappers have in their music video and throw crazy block parties and show them on that HipHop whatever site, drive in a Lambo and would not be allowed even step anywhere near the White House let alone the US president. With his pimp coat and cane, two women and gold chains.

Meanwhile, a typical ex-KGB Russian mafia boss would rather live in a heavily guarded palace in the mountains, hills or rural parts of a city or town, behind plenty of trees, natural and artificial fences and cameras and security guards armed with sniper rifles and guard dogs, with plenty of lasers all round. He would not only meet with the US president in his bedroom, but it would be a pleasure on behalf of the US president to meet with the Russian mafia boss who's just one out of many. Why? Besides the US president being a puppet, the Russian mafia boss a puppeteer can cut some of the president's strings. The president, happy to get some of those slave chains off him, will do anything to kiss ass and make millions more. If a speech does the trick in terms of PR, the president will succumb regardless of intervention or approval from the rest of the elite.

Also, note that typical Russian mafia boss = elite circles above president and all them while American street gang leader = gimmick.

You can't compare either.

In North America, I've noticed Balkan organized crime groups work alongside the Italian mafia, Hells Angels and Russian organized crime groups especially.

Russian mafia = largest and most widespread network in the world. Triads come second but exceed the Russians in terms of being the most entrentched group in the world.

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Re: Structure

Unread post by thewestside » November 10th, 2009, 12:34 am

Dobre wrote:Meanwhile, a typical ex-KGB Russian mafia boss would rather live in a heavily guarded palace in the mountains, hills or rural parts of a city or town, behind plenty of trees, natural and artificial fences and cameras and security guards armed with sniper rifles and guard dogs, with plenty of lasers all round. He would not only meet with the US president in his bedroom, but it would be a pleasure on behalf of the US president to meet with the Russian mafia boss who's just one out of many. Why? Besides the US president being a puppet, the Russian mafia boss a puppeteer can cut some of the president's strings. The president, happy to get some of those slave chains off him, will do anything to kiss ass and make millions more. If a speech does the trick in terms of PR, the president will succumb regardless of intervention or approval from the rest of the elite.
A heavily guarded palace in the mountains? Meet with the U.S. President? You are living in a dream world.
Russian mafia = largest and most widespread network in the world. Triads come second but exceed the Russians in terms of being the most entrentched group in the world.
There really aren't enough solid estimates of Russian OC membership to warrant this statement. And even going with the biggest ones, both the Triads and Yakuza have more in terms of manpower. Of course, that's only one factor in terms of power.

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Re: Structure

Unread post by Elimu » November 10th, 2009, 8:21 am

Dobre wrote:
thewestside wrote:
Elimu wrote:What about certain organized street gangs? If they drop the identifiers, colors, handsigns, handshakes,etc. will they be considered to be an organized crime group? Because you already know the defintion of a OC group and street gang but the Yakuza/Triads have a symbol & tatoos to distingush themselves but their still defined as an OC group.
The identfiers, colors, handsigns, etc. are not what keep street gangs from being labeled "organized crime." The difference is usually a matter of organizational structure, sophistication of operations, and so on. But there are gangs that very much could fall under the heading of organized crime. And there are some groups which are labeled organized crime that are not much more than street gangs. Sometimes the line is a very thin one and there isn't much of a difference.
Except the influence. Ironically, a typical leader of a large American street gang would rather live the life that the rappers have in their music video and throw crazy block parties and show them on that HipHop whatever site, drive in a Lambo and would not be allowed even step anywhere near the White House let alone the US president. With his pimp coat and cane, two women and gold chains.
Actually that's not true. I read up on alot of leaders and found out they live in the suburbs and stay low-key and Jeff Fort ,leader of the Black P Stone gang, had recieve an invitaion from Richard Nixon to the 1969 inauguration ball but he decline and sent two generals instead. Do more research on Chicago street gangs and you find out their borderland organized crime or criminal enterprise. Even a few Chicago police says "their the new face of organized crime."
Meanwhile, a typical ex-KGB Russian mafia boss would rather live in a heavily guarded palace in the mountains, hills or rural parts of a city or town, behind plenty of trees, natural and artificial fences and cameras and security guards armed with sniper rifles and guard dogs, with plenty of lasers all round. He would not only meet with the US president in his bedroom, but it would be a pleasure on behalf of the US president to meet with the Russian mafia boss who's just one out of many. Why? Besides the US president being a puppet, the Russian mafia boss a puppeteer can cut some of the president's strings. The president, happy to get some of those slave chains off him, will do anything to kiss ass and make millions more. If a speech does the trick in terms of PR, the president will succumb regardless of intervention or approval from the rest of the elite.

Also, note that typical Russian mafia boss = elite circles above president and all them while American street gang leader = gimmick.

You can't compare either.

In North America, I've noticed Balkan organized crime groups work alongside the Italian mafia, Hells Angels and Russian organized crime groups especially.

Russian mafia = largest and most widespread network in the world. Triads come second but exceed the Russians in terms of being the most entrentched group in the world.

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Re: Structure

Unread post by Elimu » November 10th, 2009, 8:23 am

thewestside wrote:
Dobre wrote:Meanwhile, a typical ex-KGB Russian mafia boss would rather live in a heavily guarded palace in the mountains, hills or rural parts of a city or town, behind plenty of trees, natural and artificial fences and cameras and security guards armed with sniper rifles and guard dogs, with plenty of lasers all round. He would not only meet with the US president in his bedroom, but it would be a pleasure on behalf of the US president to meet with the Russian mafia boss who's just one out of many. Why? Besides the US president being a puppet, the Russian mafia boss a puppeteer can cut some of the president's strings. The president, happy to get some of those slave chains off him, will do anything to kiss ass and make millions more. If a speech does the trick in terms of PR, the president will succumb regardless of intervention or approval from the rest of the elite.
A heavily guarded palace in the mountains? Meet with the U.S. President? You are living in a dream world.
Russian mafia = largest and most widespread network in the world. Triads come second but exceed the Russians in terms of being the most entrentched group in the world.
There really aren't enough solid estimates of Russian OC membership to warrant this statement. And even going with the biggest ones, both the Triads and Yakuza have more in terms of manpower. Of course, that's only one factor in terms of power.
Isn't the triads more worldwide than the yakuza?

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Re: Structure

Unread post by Faciulina » November 10th, 2009, 9:27 am

Russian mafia = largest and most widespread network in the world. Triads come second but exceed the Russians in terms of being the most entrentched group in the world.
russian mafia who? it's not an unique organization, it's formed even by several different etnich groups like georgians, chchens, armenians etc... triads the most entrenched? loooool where? they don't control even chianatowns across the world that are full of outside punk street gangs, triads are present only in hong kong in the rest of the world there are chinese gangs not triads, except maybe some sporadic cells in north america and england, they have not any politic connections outside hong kong... italian mafia is far the largest most widepsread and most entrenched organized crime groups it's present litterally in all the 5 continents it's the strongest in 3 contintents and it has political connections everywhere

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Re: Structure

Unread post by DutchGangster69 » November 10th, 2009, 3:51 pm

A heavily guarded palace in the mountains? Meet with the U.S. President? You are living in a dream world.
I agree!

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Re: Structure

Unread post by Dobre » November 10th, 2009, 5:55 pm

Faciulina wrote:
Russian mafia = largest and most widespread network in the world. Triads come second but exceed the Russians in terms of being the most entrentched group in the world.
russian mafia who? it's not an unique organization, it's formed even by several different etnich groups like georgians, chchens, armenians etc... triads the most entrenched? loooool where? they don't control even chianatowns across the world that are full of outside punk street gangs, triads are present only in hong kong in the rest of the world there are chinese gangs not triads, except maybe some sporadic cells in north america and england, they have not any politic connections outside hong kong... italian mafia is far the largest most widepsread and most entrenched organized crime groups it's present litterally in all the 5 continents it's the strongest in 3 contintents and it has political connections everywhere
...

I've told you before, and I'm not going to tell you again. If you have any questions to ask, eat some calzones so you'll think clearly again and read my older posts.

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Re: Structure

Unread post by Dobre » November 10th, 2009, 6:28 pm

thewestside wrote:
Dobre wrote:Meanwhile, a typical ex-KGB Russian mafia boss would rather live in a heavily guarded palace in the mountains, hills or rural parts of a city or town, behind plenty of trees, natural and artificial fences and cameras and security guards armed with sniper rifles and guard dogs, with plenty of lasers all round. He would not only meet with the US president in his bedroom, but it would be a pleasure on behalf of the US president to meet with the Russian mafia boss who's just one out of many. Why? Besides the US president being a puppet, the Russian mafia boss a puppeteer can cut some of the president's strings. The president, happy to get some of those slave chains off him, will do anything to kiss ass and make millions more. If a speech does the trick in terms of PR, the president will succumb regardless of intervention or approval from the rest of the elite.
A heavily guarded palace in the mountains? Meet with the U.S. President? You are living in a dream world.
Russian mafia = largest and most widespread network in the world. Triads come second but exceed the Russians in terms of being the most entrentched group in the world.
There really aren't enough solid estimates of Russian OC membership to warrant this statement. And even going with the biggest ones, both the Triads and Yakuza have more in terms of manpower. Of course, that's only one factor in terms of power.
LOL. http://criminalnaya.ru/

I don't just look at Western websites or agencies as with you. I analyze everything from all points of view before I come to a conclusion.

First you'd go against speculation and accept only credible sources and now you're for it when it comes to facing the cold hard truth. Wtf?

Oh my fucking God. For the love of fuck, are you stupid as well? The biggest ones are fucking obviously the Triads and the fucking Yakuza, but I never fucking included numbers for a reason. Just because it's a network that's the largest and most widespread does not mean it has the most of something.

As for a heavily guarded place in the mountains and meeting with the US president is not a fantasy or a dream world, to you as a brainwashed psuedointellect who thinks alternatives never exist and the absolute is final, it maybe a dream world.

To me it's reality. This is why I look at the world from the point of view of a Freemason or Eliteist while you look at the world from the view of just another US citizen. US citizens = don't like the Elite's ideas but they also protect their national soveriegnty for the sake of blind patriotism.

So you're not a complete douchebag or lost cause, you're somewhere in the middle.

Whereas some will go against my type, you will be there to die for me. You'll be one of those who either commands my armies or who will fight in them. Being older, you'll be an officer or some shit.

BUT IN REALITY

Millionaires Club Has 200,000 Bulgarian Members
The rich Bulgarians invest in planes, swanky cars and pictures

He has a home in Spain or at the French Riviera. He skis in the Alps in winter and spends the summer onboard his own yacht. His money is invested in pictures and works of art. He is young and runs his own business. He has good command of several foreign languages, and has a diploma of a prestigious Western university. He has come back to Bulgaria to spend his money here.
This is in brief a portrait of a rich Bulgarian. And there are many of them: 200,000. They are members of the Millionaires Club. Some 3.5% of the Bulgarian population describe themselves as very rich, a poll of Market Link shows. The data was presented at the Lux Only exposition, which started at the Sheraton Hotel yesterday.
For the last four years the number of the Bulgarians who have cash to burn has increased by 2%. The big shots form a new social stratum, formed by young businessmen, explained Vessela Ilieva, director of Unique Estates- an agency dealing in luxurious real estates.
According to the statistics, the richest Bulgarians are people who have their own business, as well as the Bulgarian representatives of big world companies. According to a poll of Gallup International, 44% of the people in Bulgaria belong to the middle class.

http://paper.standartnews.com/en/articl ... ticle=6836

He's a fucking James Bond villan. To you they maybe something out of a fucking James Bond movie, aka fantasy, but most movies and songs are based on what people have seen, thought, felt, heard, done, touched, smelled, tasted, experianced or whatever.

THIS, THIS JAMES BOND FANTASY IS A VERY SCARY REALITY

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FUCKING JET SKI'S, HEAVILY GUARDED HOMES IN THE ALPS, THINGS THAT YOU OR JOHNNY DON'T BELIEVE MACEDONIANS - OR RUSSIANS ARE CAPABLE OF, FUCKING NYC STOCK EXCHANGE, GARDENS AND GOLF CLUBS, SWISS GUARDS, VATICAN CITY, PARIS, GUARDING RICH PEOPLE AND CORRUPT DIPLOMATS, BATHING IN LUXURY HOTELS IN LOS ANGELES, GOING TO FUCKING CHINA AND WHATEVER THE FUCK, HANGING OUT ON BEACHES DURING THE SUMMER.

But of course, those are muscular douchebags, not mobsters. Why? Because no sources said so.

So I guess unless they have a movie or news article from the UN dedicated to them, they don't exist.

You know funny I was right about EVERYTHING. I WAS RIGHT ABOUT THE BULGARIAN-MACEDONIAN GUY WHO JACKED 600 KILOS OF COCAINE FROM THE COLUMBIANS THAT YOU AND JOHNNY AND AZURE LAUGHED AT BEFORE THEN I FOUND ARTICLES ON HIM AND HIS CONNECTIONS TO THE BIGGEST NARCODEALERS AND MAFIA BOSSES IN THE FUCKING WORLD, AND THEN YOU IMMIDIETLY SHUT THE FUCK UP, NOT SAYING A WORD ABOUT ANYTHING. NOT A SINGLE PEEP.

THEN YOU WERE LIKE OH THE OASIS AND MANDHZUZIUZKO

AND THEN I PROVIDED STATISTICS ON THE MACEDONIAN MOB BOSS MANJUKO AND HIS RUSSIAN CONNECTIONS, HIS INVOLVEMENT IN DRUG TRAFFICKING WITH ALBANIANS, HIS FUCKING BULGARIAN COUSINS IN THE OIL TRADE WITH SADDAM HUSSEIN AND YES - BEST OF ALL - HIS PARTNERS IN SWITZERLAND WITH THEIR HEAVILY GUARDED MANSIONS IN THE SWISS ALPS.

But of course...nothing I've said thus far is...real?

Must I pull a Johnny and dig up more articles out of the dark abyss that is my ass?

No problemo sir capitane. I'm doing this for your OC research, assuming you're a civilian and not a fucking retired cop or undercover and informat or anything that has to do with serving the police or federal law enforcement, whatever.

How about pictures, would you like some more of those? Or would you deny what's obvious again?

Behold, some Serbian and Macedonian mobsters

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Re: Structure

Unread post by DutchGangster69 » November 10th, 2009, 8:02 pm

LOl @ Bulgaria having 200,000 milionaires...you mean people with more then a hundred dollars.

Look at this statistic for an example which most economists go by

For International investment position: This is what residences of the country own in other countries

Bulgarian Assets Abroad: 20.2 billion euros

Russian Assets Abroad: 673 billion euros

Dutch Assets Abroad: 2.458 trillion euros

This proves the Dutch have more money then all the SLAVS combined!

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Re: Structure

Unread post by Dobre » November 11th, 2009, 2:57 pm

DutchGangster69 wrote:LOl @ Bulgaria having 200,000 milionaires...you mean people with more then a hundred dollars.

Look at this statistic for an example which most economists go by

For International investment position: This is what residences of the country own in other countries

Bulgarian Assets Abroad: 20.2 billion euros

Russian Assets Abroad: 673 billion euros

Dutch Assets Abroad: 2.458 trillion euros

This proves the Dutch have more money then all the SLAVS combined!
LMAO @ the assets of the Netherlands being 10x higher than it's GDP. That's complete bull LMFAO. Not even Chinese assets are that much. Saudi Arabia is a complete shithole and yet it has 800 billion dollars of the American economy, but does that mean it controls anything? Nope. That's Islamist interests. Russian controlled Middle East the Americans are struggling to take over while the Russians sit and laugh. Money does not equal power dumbass LOOOOOL the Georgian representitive of a Russian mafia boss had 400 million dollars in cash in Bulgaria, but so what? He's still a puppet. The Bulgarian owner of Multigroup, the 8th richest man in Eastern Europe - a puppet.

But no. That's 200,000 Euro millionaires. And you're forgetting it's a multipolar world. The Dutch are a German tribe, so the Netherlands is in direct control of the Rothschild family of Germany which backs George Soros which in turn backs and finances the operations of many ex-Yugoslav(including Macedonian) and Bulgarian businessmen, but this time directly. The Rothschild family back my dad's side of the family while the Romanov family backs my mother's side of the family.

Then you have to consider Zionist interests.

So what, Royal Dutch Shell? Controlled by Jews. Most Dutch are high on weed as we speak. I've never met a Dutchman who wasn't a marijuana addict, too high to think in numbers let alone money.

Millionaires Club Has 200,000 Bulgarian Members
The rich Bulgarians invest in planes, swanky cars and pictures

He has a home in Spain or at the French Riviera. He skis in the Alps in winter and spends the summer onboard his own yacht. His money is invested in pictures and works of art. He is young and runs his own business. He has good command of several foreign languages, and has a diploma of a prestigious Western university. He has come back to Bulgaria to spend his money here.
This is in brief a portrait of a rich Bulgarian. And there are many of them: 200,000. They are members of the Millionaires Club. Some 3.5% of the Bulgarian population describe themselves as very rich, a poll of Market Link shows. The data was presented at the Lux Only exposition, which started at the Sheraton Hotel yesterday.
For the last four years the number of the Bulgarians who have cash to burn has increased by 2%. The big shots form a new social stratum, formed by young businessmen, explained Vessela Ilieva, director of Unique Estates- an agency dealing in luxurious real estates.
According to the statistics, the richest Bulgarians are people who have their own business, as well as the Bulgarian representatives of big world companies. According to a poll of Gallup International, 44% of the people in Bulgaria belong to the middle class.

3.5% of Bulgaria's 7 million people, 'officially 7 million', or in other words 10 million.

There are about 15 million Bulgarians worldwide. That seems like a feasable number.

But then again, if Russia and China were to pull out their money from the US economy and collect on the trillions in debt the US owes them, it would completely fuck up the US economy. That's power.

You could have cash as much as you want, but the tires of your BMW X6 will still get robbed everyday by hooligans.

Meanwhile, someone 'less rich' who doesn't flash his wealth can leave his 120,000 Euro Mercedes SUV infront of his hotel during the night as drunks, thugs, Gypsies and whores prance around all over the place and not get a single scratch on it.

He can go to Bulgaria and not have his SUV stolen.

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Re: Structure

Unread post by Dobre » November 11th, 2009, 2:59 pm

DutchGangster69 wrote:LOl @ Bulgaria having 200,000 milionaires...you mean people with more then a hundred dollars.

Look at this statistic for an example which most economists go by

For International investment position: This is what residences of the country own in other countries

Bulgarian Assets Abroad: 20.2 billion euros

Russian Assets Abroad: 673 billion euros

Dutch Assets Abroad: 2.458 trillion euros

This proves the Dutch have more money then all the SLAVS combined!
Except Slavs aren't a puppet people and we actually control a pretty big piece of the world. The US and Europe are worried more about Slavic advancement than how much money they give the Dutch to grow marijuana in Holland.

Tell me the last time you had Turkish coffee in Athens.

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Re: Structure

Unread post by Dobre » November 11th, 2009, 3:03 pm

Also, the Netherlands is a pretty good place for drug operations, eh?

Maybe...watching too much District 9.

Bulgarians, Serbs, Russians and Macedonians LOVE to do their stuff there.

And those are by...nation. Alot of our businessmen have citizenship elsewhere and it would look better on paper and press to be labelled as a German, Dutch or something more peaceful with flowers all round than a Bulgarian, Macedonian or Serb.

Note that these statistics are complete bull.

In 1991, over 500 billion dollars was laundered through Bulgaria coming out of the Soviet Union.

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Re: Structure

Unread post by DutchGangster69 » November 11th, 2009, 4:08 pm

I go by actual banking statistics not fantasized numbers!

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Re: Structure

Unread post by DutchGangster69 » November 11th, 2009, 4:19 pm

puppet people
lol The Dutch have fought many wars with other nations intruding or interfering their business....such as a major war with the spanish empire (Dutch won) many wars with the English (4 Dutch won) war with Napolean (Dutch won) and also the Dutch raping the Portugese nation. If your dream fantasy is that the Dutch are puppets thats a joke.

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Re: Structure

Unread post by DutchGangster69 » November 11th, 2009, 4:21 pm

Except Slavs aren't a puppet people and we actually control a pretty big piece of the world
They live in third world conditions in shitty places in the world..The west is owned and controlled by Germanics except for the small imigrant communities in them including slavs.

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Re: Structure

Unread post by Faciulina » November 11th, 2009, 6:42 pm

I don't just look at Western websites or agencies as with you. I analyze everything from all points of view before I come to a conclusion.
loooool that's because 90% of what you say is BS... and who fuck are the clows in the pictures you always post?
Oh my #%@&#%@ God. For the love of fu--, are you stupid as well? The biggest ones are #%@&#%@ obviously the Triads and the #%@&#%@ Yakuza, but I never #%@&#%@ included numbers for a reason. Just because it's a network that's the largest and most widespread does not mean it has the most of something.
the italian mafia is the largest richest most powerful and most widespread in the world, triads and yakuza have not more members, they have both about 80.000 members and associates, italian mafia has about 200.000 so who's the largest you brainless balkan guy?
somebody think they have more members because media's idiocy, they claim yakuza has 80.000 members without explaining only less than half of them are full-members, and only 10% of triad members are active according to hong kong police... the media usually compare the whole membership of triads with italian made members only looool when italian mafia has a huge number of associates

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Re: Structure

Unread post by Azure9920 » November 11th, 2009, 8:20 pm

The Italian Mob has 200,000 members eh?

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Re: Structure

Unread post by thewestside » November 12th, 2009, 2:22 am

Azure9920 wrote:The Italian Mob has 200,000 members eh?
Between Dobre's posting pictures of muscle bound guys for no reason and Faciulina's phoney figures, it's a wonder I come here any more. I think he might be basing this off the figure of 25,000 members and 250,000 affiliates of the four major Italian groups as said on the FBI website. But as usual Faciulina screws up here.

The Cosa Nostra (Sicily) is estimated to have about 5,000 members. The 'Ndrangheta (Calabria) 6,000 members. The Camorra (Campania) 7,000 members. And the Sacra Corona Unita (Puglia) 2,000 members. That's 20,000 members.

Now the oft-used lazy man's way of estimating affiliates is 10 for every made member, which would make 200,000. Many officials use that even though it's not really based on anything.

But as hard as those numbers are to verify, the numbers of most other OC groups are even worse. 100,000 for the Triads. 90,000 for the Yakuza. These don't differentiate between members and affiliates. And I have no idea what the estimates of 50,000 to ten times as much for the Russian groups are based on.

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Re: Structure

Unread post by Dobre » November 12th, 2009, 3:49 am

DutchGangster69 wrote:
Except Slavs aren't a puppet people and we actually control a pretty big piece of the world
They live in third world conditions in _____ places in the world..The west is owned and controlled by Germanics except for the small imigrant communities in them including slavs.
I personally don't care about those who are stupid enough to stay in the gutter. I respect those who've made it out of the gutter.

As for the West, don't even mention that LMFAO. I see Western cities as my own personal playground - just as every other Slav. Visit places, enjoy the nightlife, mingle with the locals, fuck them, rob them of their valuables and then kill them, rinse and repeat.
Faciulina wrote:
I don't just look at Western websites or agencies as with you. I analyze everything from all points of view before I come to a conclusion.
loooool that's because 90% of what you say is BS... and who fu-- are the clows in the pictures you always post?
Oh my #%@&#%@ God. For the love of fu--, are you stupid as well? The biggest ones are #%@&#%@ obviously the Triads and the #%@&#%@ Yakuza, but I never #%@&#%@ included numbers for a reason. Just because it's a network that's the largest and most widespread does not mean it has the most of something.
the italian mafia is the largest richest most powerful and most widespread in the world, triads and yakuza have not more members, they have both about 80.000 members and associates, italian mafia has about 200.000 so who's the largest you brainless balkan guy?
somebody think they have more members because media's idiocy, they claim yakuza has 80.000 members without explaining only less than half of them are full-members, and only 10% of triad members are active according to hong kong police... the media usually compare the whole membership of triads with italian made members only looool when italian mafia has a huge number of associates
...

LMAO. The Triads alone have about 500,000 members. The entire spectrum of individuals frequently engaging in organized crime activity in Southeast Asia, so Indonesia, China, Japan, Thailand, Burma, Vietnam, Malasiya, The Phillipines, Cambodia and Laos number over 1.8 million.

The Italian mafia has 25,000 members and 250,000 associates, so the correct number would be 275,000 in total.

Well...I wouldn't know, there isn't any official estimates but we can always guess. The number of local street(drug) dealers in Veles, Macedonia, a town of 50,000 people, alone, number 400 people. It just gives you an idea of the overall picture of what a street dealer that sells only to citizens of that town is capable of compared to people whom have access abroad, like the actual gangsters, which quintiple in number and their power and wealth and material possesions cannot even be matched by the typical fucking American millionaire. We're talking James Bond here, this is Macedonia 21st century, there's no more bullcrap, it's just fraud and legitimate enterprise covering illigitemate enterprise and drug trafficking, and the best of all --- the European Union funds it. Guess what, my town gets the first European Union finance out of any other Macedonian city. Cha-ching.

There is a defunct Socialist enterprise that used to operate in my town called Red Star. The main director of that company is the father of the richest man in Macedonia during the 1990's and one of the most profilic Macedonian mafia bosses of the 1990's and 2000's. His son goes to a private American school called Nova in the capital with the sons and daughters of presidents, CEO's and politicians and celebirties - not just Macedonian, but worldwide! There's tons of Russian kids in that school.

Best of all, I'm related and he has international impunity.
DutchGangster69 wrote:
puppet people
lol The Dutch have fought many wars with other nations intruding or interfering their business....such as a major war with the spanish empire (Dutch won) many wars with the English (4 Dutch won) war with Napolean (Dutch won) and also the Dutch raping the Portugese nation. If your dream fantasy is that the Dutch are puppets thats a joke.
Right, the Dutch won in the war against Nepoleon. In 200 years you'll also say the Dutch won in the war against the Martians. Weed smoke suffocated the poor things.
Azure9920 wrote:The Italian Mob has 200,000 members eh?
Apperently, that's the way the cookie crumbles.
thewestside wrote:
Azure9920 wrote:The Italian Mob has 200,000 members eh?
Between Dobre's posting pictures of muscle bound guys for no reason and Faciulina's phoney figures, it's a wonder I come here any more. I think he might be basing this off the figure of 25,000 members and 250,000 affiliates of the four major Italian groups as said on the FBI website. But as usual Faciulina screws up here.

The Cosa Nostra (Sicily) is estimated to have about 5,000 members. The 'Ndrangheta (Calabria) 6,000 members. The Camorra (Campania) 7,000 members. And the Sacra Corona Unita (Puglia) 2,000 members. That's 20,000 members.

Now the oft-used lazy man's way of estimating affiliates is 10 for every made member, which would make 200,000. Many officials use that even though it's not really based on anything.

But as hard as those numbers are to verify, the numbers of most other OC groups are even worse. 100,000 for the Triads. 90,000 for the Yakuza. These don't differentiate between members and affiliates. And I have no idea what the estimates of 50,000 to ten times as much for the Russian groups are based on.
Of course, muscle bound guys. They're sportsman, in the friggin special olympics, bodyguards of Macedonian politicians, Transporter type shit, nothing special, travelling the world from Los Angeles to the Great wall of China. What was I thinking.

But...

Reality is that the Albanian mafia is the 3rd most powerful group in Europe?

Maybe on Serbianna.com, but in the real world, the Russian mafia is the most powerful group in the Balkans because it pulls the strings of every Slavic group and nation which dominate the Balkans, followed by the Bulgarian mafia out of the domestic groups for first and second for the Serbian mafia, THEN the Albanian mafia, followed by the Macedonian mob. I wouldn't consider the Bulgarians and Macedonians to be seperate, just as I wouldn't consider the Serbs, Bosniaks and Croat underworlds to be seperate.

Reality is harsh, I could hardly get you people to believe a Bulgarian businessman/mafia boss/drug lord with Macedonian connections jacked 600 kilos of cocaine from the Columbians, but I'm probably never going to get you to believe a Serbian(Montegrin, same shit, only more tribal and fez wearing) businessman tried to smuggle in 2,800 kilos of cocaine into Montenegro......................................without having Johnny ride me about how it was the Albanians in Montenegro(even though there's no Albanians in Montenegro) or Faculina saying the Italians for some reason instead of smuggling into the Balkans instead of through Italy or one of those ports they control in Spain directly......or something..

Society

Three suspects in smuggling of two tons of drugs defend themselves with silence
One shipment of cocaine smuggled in April by a ship
Author: V. Z. Cvijić | 19.10.2009 - 08:59

Image

Belgrade - Drug dealers behind shipment of more than 2 tons of cocaine confiscated in Uruguay last week, managed to smuggle in April this year an unknown quantity of drugs by a ship, ‘La Nacion’ daily of Argentina with largest circulation reports.

This daily also reports that the arrested Serbian nationals have been in Argentina since March this year.
‘It is expected for domino effect to follow after arrests in Serbia so that the whole net is disclosed’, a spokesman of a court in Argentina said.
The judge ordered issuance of international wanted list after four Serbs. The police in Uruguay raised protection of individuals that took part in the action pf confiscation of cocaine for fear from revenge. Media in Uruguay and Argentina report that ‘Serbian mafia’ plans revenge. That is why the navy intelligence service has been engaged to take care of security of the policemen participating in the action. Special measures have been introduced in a prison in which one of the arrested suspects is being kept.
Zeljko Vujanovic, Marko Vorotovic and Nikola Pavlovic, suspected to have been involved in smuggling of 2.1 tons of cocaine have been ruled one-month detention by investigation judge of a court in Belgrade. He also decided about launching of an investigation against them.
The three arrested suspects said at hearing that they are not guilty and refused to say anything else so the investigation judge concluded that they were defending themselves with silence.
The police in Uruguay issued wanted list after four Serbian nationals suspected to manage to run away from a yacht that was sailing under English flag when 2.1. tons of cocaine were confiscated.
The investigation bodies in Serbia think that the individual that ordered the cocaine is one of presently most controversial and powerful Montenegrin businessmen. According to information available, Serbian Police and the BIA have been monitoring for months the main suspect and members of his group. The organizer of smuggling is leader of a clan from Montenegro with huge business in Serbia.

http://www.blic.rs/society.php?id=5348

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Re: Structure

Unread post by Faciulina » November 12th, 2009, 12:30 pm

LMAO. The Triads alone have about 500,000 members. The entire spectrum of individuals frequently engaging in organized crime activity in Southeast Asia, so Indonesia, China, Japan, Thailand, Burma, Vietnam, Malasiya, The Phillipines, Cambodia and Laos number over 1.8 million.
looooool that's your fantasy

Hong Kong's 15 or so active triad gangs have an estimated 20,000 members

http://www.nytimes.com/1988/12/12/world ... wanted=all

While it is difficult to determine the exact number of triad members in Hong Kong, most authorities agree that there are at least 80 000

http://www.fas.org/irp/world/australia/ ... aaoc2.html

In Hong Kong, it is estimated that there are 50 triad societies with a total membership of at least 80000. Of these societies, about fifteen are criminally active

www.illuminatedlantern.com/cinema/.../triads.php
The Italian Mob has 200,000 members eh?
no, they are more, 275.000 globally, 200.000 in italy

The Italian O.C. according to authorities it has about 21.000 “made members” and more than 200.000 “associates”

http://gangstersinc.tripod.com/EuroItalian.html

There are several groups currently active in the U.S.: the Sicilian Mafia; the Camorra or Neapolitan Mafia; the ’Ndrangheta or Calabrian Mafia; and the Sacra Corona Unita or United Sacred Crown.
We estimate the four groups have approximately 25,000 members total, with 250,000 affiliates worldwide.


http://www.fbi.gov/hq/cid/orgcrime/lcnindex.htm

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Re: Structure

Unread post by Elimu » November 12th, 2009, 1:28 pm

All of this comes to one conclusion which is estimates. There's only a few approximate membership but majority of these numbers will only be estimates and stop argueing over who's more larger than the next it's silly. Numbers doesn't mean anything at all. Faciulina, your resources on the triads has been seen multiple times and tthe only problem is that their outdated. Triad membership could be higher/lower but there worldwide influence prove that membership is high. And for the embellish Italian Mafia that's always in the spotlight, their worldwide but as far as "real members" go it's only in the low to mid tens of thousand. Numbers doesn't mean anything except for money.Why do you SAME individuals roll your SAME arguments to other topics? Go open another topic and label it debate and argue there and get off this topic if you have nothing on the subject. By continually scolding someone, they in time become accustomed to it and despise your reproof.

Faciulina wrote:
LMAO. The Triads alone have about 500,000 members. The entire spectrum of individuals frequently engaging in organized crime activity in Southeast Asia, so Indonesia, China, Japan, Thailand, Burma, Vietnam, Malasiya, The Phillipines, Cambodia and Laos number over 1.8 million.
looooool that's your fantasy

Hong Kong's 15 or so active triad gangs have an estimated 20,000 members

http://www.nytimes.com/1988/12/12/world ... wanted=all

While it is difficult to determine the exact number of triad members in Hong Kong, most authorities agree that there are at least 80 000

http://www.fas.org/irp/world/australia/ ... aaoc2.html

In Hong Kong, it is estimated that there are 50 triad societies with a total membership of at least 80000. Of these societies, about fifteen are criminally active

http://www.illuminatedlantern.com/cinema/.../triads.php
The Italian Mob has 200,000 members eh?
no, they are more, 275.000 globally, 200.000 in italy

The Italian O.C. according to authorities it has about 21.000 “made members” and more than 200.000 “associates”

http://gangstersinc.tripod.com/EuroItalian.html

There are several groups currently active in the U.S.: the Sicilian Mafia; the Camorra or Neapolitan Mafia; the ’Ndrangheta or Calabrian Mafia; and the Sacra Corona Unita or United Sacred Crown.
We estimate the four groups have approximately 25,000 members total, with 250,000 affiliates worldwide.


http://www.fbi.gov/hq/cid/orgcrime/lcnindex.htm

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Re: Structure

Unread post by DutchGangster69 » November 12th, 2009, 1:35 pm

Macedonian mob
lol hahahahahaha

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Re: Structure

Unread post by Dobre » November 12th, 2009, 3:13 pm

Faciulina wrote:
LMAO. The Triads alone have about 500,000 members. The entire spectrum of individuals frequently engaging in organized crime activity in Southeast Asia, so Indonesia, China, Japan, Thailand, Burma, Vietnam, Malasiya, The Phillipines, Cambodia and Laos number over 1.8 million.
looooool that's your fantasy

Hong Kong's 15 or so active triad gangs have an estimated 20,000 members

http://www.nytimes.com/1988/12/12/world ... wanted=all

While it is difficult to determine the exact number of triad members in Hong Kong, most authorities agree that there are at least 80 000

http://www.fas.org/irp/world/australia/ ... aaoc2.html

In Hong Kong, it is estimated that there are 50 triad societies with a total membership of at least 80000. Of these societies, about fifteen are criminally active

http://www.illuminatedlantern.com/cinema/.../triads.php
The Italian Mob has 200,000 members eh?
no, they are more, 275.000 globally, 200.000 in italy

The Italian O.C. according to authorities it has about 21.000 “made members” and more than 200.000 “associates”

http://gangstersinc.tripod.com/EuroItalian.html

There are several groups currently active in the U.S.: the Sicilian Mafia; the Camorra or Neapolitan Mafia; the ’Ndrangheta or Calabrian Mafia; and the Sacra Corona Unita or United Sacred Crown.
We estimate the four groups have approximately 25,000 members total, with 250,000 affiliates worldwide.


http://www.fbi.gov/hq/cid/orgcrime/lcnindex.htm
So...Hong Kong like represents all of China? Yes, there are 80,000 members in 50 Triad societies in Hong Kong. But you forget Beijing and other 50 Chinese cities with an administrative population of over 1 million people and it's usually in the smaller rural communities where these organizations operate out of.

No, that's reality. It's news from a Canadian reporter who lives in Japan and has contact with these guys. Also note that members of an organization will make sure to do anything to keep estimates as low as possible on the law enforcements side...if not completely invisable...

As a white Macedonian with knowledge of Italian, Balkan and Soviet organized crime groups, I can say the most that this alliance can fear is the Asian groups. This is why we respect them instead. I wish to thank the Chinese government for providing every single educational insitution in Macedonia with computers for every student.

I also want to note that recently there was a meeting between the Chinese prime minister, the Bulgarian prime minister and Bulgarian and Chinese businessmen.

Also, those 275,000 people the FBI mentions are members and associates that are known to them. There are many more who are not known to Federal law enforcement agencies worldwide, yet.
DutchGangster69 wrote:
Macedonian mob
lol hahahahahaha
?

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Re: Structure

Unread post by Dobre » November 12th, 2009, 3:17 pm

I wouldn't laugh if I was you Dutch, Macedonian organized crime figures are very well connected worldwide. I know for a fact they work alongside Russians and Italians abroad.

And like they said, in the first half of the 20th century, especially around 1903 and 1912, there was millions of Macedonian immigrants and refugees flooding into America, just as Irish and Italian immigrants.

But, unlike them, we don't like noise. Otherwise I'm pretty sure I can find you plenty of examples of Macedonians being associates of the Italian mob back then. It's in our blood. Especially those who've been through vendettas and civil war. They make great button men.

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Re: Structure

Unread post by Faciulina » November 12th, 2009, 4:16 pm

So...Hong Kong like represents all of China? Yes, there are 80,000 members in 50 Triad societies in Hong Kong. But you forget Beijing and other 50 Chinese cities with an administrative population of over 1 million people and it's usually in the smaller rural communities where these organizations operate out of.
hong kong is the stronghold of the triads, their heart, over 90% of members are located there, there are other triads groups in taiwan and macau, but the triad presence in the rest of china is very low or non-existant

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Re: Structure

Unread post by Dobre » November 13th, 2009, 9:27 pm

Faciulina wrote:
So...Hong Kong like represents all of China? Yes, there are 80,000 members in 50 Triad societies in Hong Kong. But you forget Beijing and other 50 Chinese cities with an administrative population of over 1 million people and it's usually in the smaller rural communities where these organizations operate out of.
hong kong is the stronghold of the triads, their heart, over 90% of members are located there, there are other triads groups in taiwan and macau, but the triad presence in the rest of china is very low or non-existant
Maybe in your mind yes, but in the real world, the Triads are everywhere. Wherever there's a Chinese laundromat, confection or restaurant, there's the Triads. And it's a very real reality, not just a stereotype. This is because the Triads also act as a secret society, as a representative for the Chinese nation and people as they have for thousands of years. Traditions never die because a culture is the soul of the people and people who protect this will die for anything. This is like if the Americans didn't drop the A-Bomb on Hiroshima and Nagasaki, the Japanese would've never stopped.

No, lmao, Hong Kong is the Triads' HQ in the Rush Hour series.

Try watching Gommorra for a change, you'll see Chinese and Nigerians in the movie.

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