THE COSA NOSTRA TODAY

American organized crime groups included traditional groups such as La Cosa Nostra & the Italian Mafia to modern groups such as Black Mafia Family. Discuss the most organized criminal groups in the United States including gangs in Canada.
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This section discusses organized crime groups in the US and Canadian street gangs.
Faciulina
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Re: THE COSA NOSTRA TODAY

Unread postby Faciulina » December 22nd, 2009, 7:56 pm

The only group that's older than La Cosa Nostra have to be the Chinese Tongs. Because the LCN was active since the 1880's or 1890's but the Tongs have been active during the 1870's. That's the only group that I can think of with a longevity that exceed La Cosa Nostra.


do you have serious source that proof chinese tongs are older than italian mafia in the states?

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Re: THE COSA NOSTRA TODAY

Unread postby Elimu » December 27th, 2009, 6:16 pm

Faciulina wrote:
The only group that's older than La Cosa Nostra have to be the Chinese Tongs. Because the LCN was active since the 1880's or 1890's but the Tongs have been active during the 1870's. That's the only group that I can think of with a longevity that exceed La Cosa Nostra.


do you have serious source that proof chinese tongs are older than italian mafia in the states?


www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/599143/tong-war

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Re: THE COSA NOSTRA TODAY

Unread postby mayugastank » February 20th, 2010, 9:01 pm

Faculina-

Why compare italian mafia to mexican cartels they are different. The italians have hundreds of years of history-they have made errors and changed throughout time. Mexican organized crime is under 50 years old. How can you put a 50 year old organization against an italian mafia tradition with some 800 years of history? of course the italians are going to be better organzied and controlled. When Lucky Luciano organized the NY mob they were killing eachother all over the place they were whacking bosses and people had little organization compared to after the start of the commission. Thats where the mexican cartels are now, they are battling for power lack structure , because they are 700 years younger then the italians. People are killing eachother all over their because they are still new to the game -they dont have that traditional organized structure. Wait some 20 years or more and then see how it changes. The killing cant go on forever. Who knows what will emerge? maybe more powerful then the italians ,maybe not but right now its a cowboy circus over there. Thats hwo italy was for awhile and tahts how the Cosa Nostra started in NYC. The major cartels are all under 20 years old. LA FAMILIA is like less then 10 years old. Organized crime like the italian mafia is just starting in Mexico. Mexicans may be more ruthless now simply because its the wild west over there. People getting bumped off every day.

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Re: THE COSA NOSTRA TODAY

Unread postby thewestside » February 21st, 2010, 1:33 am

Sometimes that organization breaks down even with the Italians. Sicily was a bloodbath back in the late 1970's and early 1980's when the Corleonesi took over. To this day the Camorra clans are often still at each other's throats in Naples. That's where a body like the Commission can help to stave off wars and infighting.

I expect that what happened in Colombia will eventually happen in Mexico. Sooner or later the power and violence of the cartels is reigned in once most or all of the major leaders are captured or killed. Then, like Colombia, you will have a number of smaller cartels who are much more low key and restrain their violence more. Sooner or later they have to adapt or they go the way of Colombia's Medellin Cartel and Mexico's Guadalajara Cartel.

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Re: THE COSA NOSTRA TODAY

Unread postby mayugastank » February 22nd, 2010, 12:22 am

thewestside wrote:Sometimes that organization breaks down even with the Italians. Sicily was a bloodbath back in the late 1970's and early 1980's when the Corleonesi took over. To this day the Camorra clans are often still at each other's throats in Naples. That's where a body like the Commission can help to stave off wars and infighting.

I expect that what happened in Colombia will eventually happen in Mexico. Sooner or later the power and violence of the cartels is reigned in once most or all of the major leaders are captured or killed. Then, like Colombia, you will have a number of smaller cartels who are much more low key and restrain their violence more. Sooner or later they have to adapt or they go the way of Colombia's Medellin Cartel and Mexico's Guadalajara Cartel.





Their is differnces -In Columbia during its heyday and Mexico today/I dont see Mexico going the way of Columbia.

My reasons: LA FAMILA, TEXAS SYNDICATE, TRICITY BOMBERS, etc...........GANGS! Bloodoaths, structures and discipline for lack of committment. Many have constuitutions and bylaws.........Columbia as far as I know doesnt have anything similiar to what constitues a criminal organization with a constitution and rules of inductment and behaviour. Like Serbs ,Bosnians ,Russians and most others -their organized crime consists of paramilitary, and corrupt goverment officials -a mixture of goverment and corruption. Just a bunch of ex -police and soldiers getting into the rackets. In many of the countrys -political aspirations drive the need for cash. IE( FArc, Taliban. KLA...IRA etc..) Just my opinions and nothing more though....

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Re: THE COSA NOSTRA TODAY

Unread postby thewestside » February 22nd, 2010, 11:22 pm

mayugastank wrote:Their is differnces -In Columbia during its heyday and Mexico today/I dont see Mexico going the way of Columbia.

My reasons: LA FAMILA, TEXAS SYNDICATE, TRICITY BOMBERS, etc...........GANGS! Bloodoaths, structures and discipline for lack of committment. Many have constuitutions and bylaws.........Columbia as far as I know doesnt have anything similiar to what constitues a criminal organization with a constitution and rules of inductment and behaviour. Like Serbs ,Bosnians ,Russians and most others -their organized crime consists of paramilitary, and corrupt goverment officials -a mixture of goverment and corruption. Just a bunch of ex -police and soldiers getting into the rackets. In many of the countrys -political aspirations drive the need for cash. IE( FArc, Taliban. KLA...IRA etc..) Just my opinions and nothing more though....


First off, while local gangs like the Texas Syndicate, Tricity Bombers, etc. have connections to the cartels in Mexico, they are not the major players here. It's the cartels in Mexico - the Sinaloa cartel, the Gulf cartel, the Juarez cartel, the Tijuana cartel, etc. And there really isn't any substantial difference between them and the cartels in Colombia in the past, i.e. Medellin, Cali, Norte del Valle, or paramilitary groups like FARC. It's history repeating itself.

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Re: THE COSA NOSTRA TODAY

Unread postby mayugastank » February 23rd, 2010, 3:44 am

thewestside wrote:
mayugastank wrote:Their is differnces -In Columbia during its heyday and Mexico today/I dont see Mexico going the way of Columbia.

My reasons: LA FAMILA, TEXAS SYNDICATE, TRICITY BOMBERS, etc...........GANGS! Bloodoaths, structures and discipline for lack of committment. Many have constuitutions and bylaws.........Columbia as far as I know doesnt have anything similiar to what constitues a criminal organization with a constitution and rules of inductment and behaviour. Like Serbs ,Bosnians ,Russians and most others -their organized crime consists of paramilitary, and corrupt goverment officials -a mixture of goverment and corruption. Just a bunch of ex -police and soldiers getting into the rackets. In many of the countrys -political aspirations drive the need for cash. IE( FArc, Taliban. KLA...IRA etc..) Just my opinions and nothing more though....


First off, while local gangs like the Texas Syndicate, Tricity Bombers, etc. have connections to the cartels in Mexico, they are not the major players here. It's the cartels in Mexico - the Sinaloa cartel, the Gulf cartel, the Juarez cartel, the Tijuana cartel, etc. And there really isn't any substantial difference between them and the cartels in Colombia in the past, i.e. Medellin, Cali, Norte del Valle, or paramilitary groups like FARC. It's history repeating itself.




Their are big differences. A cartel is a loose affiliation of family members or sometimes govenors,soldiers,cops. Alot of times the abuse of power in goverment drives intellectuals to commit criminal acts for profit. The so-called cartels are fragile-they hold NO history, share NO common criminal code, and abide by the rules of one upmanship( whoever is stronger at that moment runs the situation) ,they regularly inform on eachother, hold not to much beliefs in not snitching and in all actuality are alot of times nothing more then corrupt PIGS. Groups like the TJ cartel were joined at the hip to Surenos in LA. Surenos in LA abide and follow some type of criminal code -that forbids informing, cowardice and unity to a cause-street-gang or long time friends. Alot of the gangs active in the cartel wars are 100% AMERICAN MADE. 100% anti-goverment and 100% criminal. As opposed to the dirty judges who get people locked up in Columbia and then take over their rackets. That isnt a cartel or mafia or anything similiar to a structured -organization that is able to replenish itself and readapt to times and different mores. Which is why PAblo Escobars cartel is done and most the other ones during those times have also been replaced.

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Re: THE COSA NOSTRA TODAY

Unread postby mayugastank » February 23rd, 2010, 3:57 am

Furthermore political aspirations arent compatible with criminal codes or criminal behaviour. These guys are SCAN_D_LESS! just look at Noriega or the contras, buncha cops trying to play gangster. Doing eachother all over the place. The word mafia is thrown around so much and labeled on any 2 bit group. Arturo Beltran Leyva, wont even be a memory in a couple years. But the groups in Mexico are starting to metamorphize. LA Familia has a constitution,rules of behaviour and structure,unlike anything in Columbia. My belief is that full scale mafias will emerge and Mexico wont resemble anything like Columbia. Most of these ideas came from way of Los Angelos as Mexico didnt have a gang problem until people from the states showed Mexico what criminal life is. We spoke before on the history of LA gangs and you wrongly believed all hispanic gangs in LA to be post 1960s inventions. I stated previously that their is not hardly a gang in LA -of hispanic origin that is that young. That their are just about ZERO gangs in ELA under 80 years old. If you take a look at cartel violence photos or victims of the violence youll see tattoos that are only worn by American gangs. Its an impossibility for MExicans to not be influencced somehow by the 35% of Mexicans who live in America. 35% of Mexicos population resides in the USA.

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Re: THE COSA NOSTRA TODAY

Unread postby thewestside » February 23rd, 2010, 5:40 pm

You seem to have an obession with the Mexican gangs here in the U.S. because you keep bringing them up, even though I've already said they are not the dominant players here, no matter how much you might wish to believe otherwise. Your belief that it's the gangs in the U.S. that are influencing Mexico is beyond ridiculous. The influence goes the other way. The cartels have the money, the power, the international connections, the drug supply. You're trying to argue that it's the tail wagging the dog and I'm not falling for it.

The cartels in Mexico are organized along generally the same lines as those in Colombia in the past. They are in the same business. Some have diversified but drugs will always be their bread and butter. We've already seen several of the top Mexican drug lords go down over the past decade. Eventually the six or seven major cartels will fracture, just as they did in Colombia, and be replaced by several smaller ones who are more compartmentalized and more low key.

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Re: THE COSA NOSTRA TODAY

Unread postby skag » June 7th, 2010, 4:48 pm

I made my way here from google and just had to comment on the original post because nearly all of that is utter rubbish LCN made up of junkies and no marks, are you having a joke, you believe what the guy said? You must be proper gullible to believe that shite!

They are still involved in the rackets they always were garment industry, construction etc etc.

There are still informants that come forward and say these things. You read one book or excerpts from a book of some junkie and make a judgement on the whole of LCN on his say so?

They may not be the power they once were but they are still a big power and not to be messed with!

The Mafia didn't just start in the 19th century it started in the 11th century at the time of the first crusades maybe before that!

I've been obsessed with the Sicilian/Italian mafia since being a child and there's no doubt they are in a worst state they have ever been in but never as bad a the OP says.

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Re: THE COSA NOSTRA TODAY

Unread postby thewestside » June 7th, 2010, 9:32 pm

skag wrote:I made my way here from google and just had to comment on the original post because nearly all of that is utter rubbish LCN made up of junkies and no marks, are you having a joke, you believe what the guy said? You must be proper gullible to believe that shite!

They are still involved in the rackets they always were garment industry, construction etc etc.

There are still informants that come forward and say these things. You read one book or excerpts from a book of some junkie and make a judgement on the whole of LCN on his say so?

They may not be the power they once were but they are still a big power and not to be messed with!

The Mafia didn't just start in the 19th century it started in the 11th century at the time of the first crusades maybe before that!

I've been obsessed with the Sicilian/Italian mafia since being a child and there's no doubt they are in a worst state they have ever been in but never as bad a the OP says.


mayugastank made the mistake of passing judgement on the entire mob from what he read about one crew in one family in one book. You really have to delve deep into many sources as possible over an extended period of time to get a good picture of the state of the mob today. Though you don't want to go back too far or your information becomes outdated. Personally, I look at all the information available - i.e. indictments, press releases, articles, reports, etc. - over the last decade.

On one hand, I would have to say there really isn't a single industry in New York that the mob still controls like it did many up through most of the 1990's. In some they appear to have been removed altogether. Those would include the garment center, the airports, and trade shows at the Javits Center. There haven't been any mob-related cases in those areas in at least 15 years. On the other hand, they still remain involved to varying degrees in other industries. Those would include the waterfront, trucking, carting, and above all, construction.

Beyond that, the mob's various illicit activities - gambling, loansharking, extortion, drug trafficking, stolen goods, fraud, etc. - continue on as they always have.

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Re: THE COSA NOSTRA TODAY

Unread postby sickside » June 8th, 2010, 1:34 am

man who gives a fuck..and Mexicans didn't copy no one..no criminal copes a criminal..you know why..because the Italians didn't start the first freaking crime in the world fool..damn..and if any thing they ant no 800 years..lol...the word "mafia" that no one knows for sure where it originated from..but the word came out like 800 years ago..and even if they did..which they didn't ..but if they did...that was over there!..not in America..EME,WFx4, cartels ..are American made..but Mexico has Mexican mafia familys too down there that been there before any American type shit popped up just like the Italians..and no one knows when they started just like the Italians..because ..THEY ARE A FUCKING SECRET ORGANIZE CRIME !...no net, no fucking book, shit no one in the street or even them selves most likely know there true history ..dead men dont talk!..they die with there secrets because thats just how it is..thats there life style....and whats so freaking funny..is all the organize crime shit in America all started all the same...there are gangs..and than they became mobsters and the mobsters recruit members from the gangs.., Charles "Lucky" Luciano,Al Capone, and others...its just the way it is..its fucking common sense.....you sell weed for a min. eventual you are going to sell something bigger...because its just how it is...its crime..no one copies anyone..its just crime starting by nature..

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Re: THE COSA NOSTRA TODAY

Unread postby youngspade » June 13th, 2010, 11:09 am

sickside wrote:man who gives a fu--..and Mexicans didn't copy no one..no criminal copes a criminal..you know why..because the Italians didn't start the first freaking crime in the world fool..damn..and if any thing they ant no 800 years..lol...the word "mafia" that no one knows for sure where it originated from..but the word came out like 800 years ago..and even if they did..which they didn't ..but if they did...that was over there!..not in America..EME,WFx4, cartels ..are American made..but Mexico has Mexican mafia familys too down there that been there before any American type shit popped up just like the Italians..and no one knows when they started just like the Italians..because ..THEY ARE A #%@&#%@ SECRET ORGANIZE CRIME !...no net, no #%@&#%@ book, shit no one in the street or even them selves most likely know there true history ..dead men dont talk!..they die with there secrets because thats just how it is..thats there life style....and whats so freaking funny..is all the organize crime shit in America all started all the same...there are gangs..and than they became mobsters and the mobsters recruit members from the gangs.., Charles "Lucky" Luciano,Al Capone, and others...its just the way it is..its #%@&#%@ common sense.....you sell weed for a min. eventual you are going to sell something bigger...because its just how it is...its crime..no one copies anyone..its just crime starting by nature..



This one tyme I can not agree with you! Mexicans was farmers until Colombians even made you guys a factor in the 80s. Not saying all you guys were farmers in them days but you guys werent a Mafia or a Cartel until after THE COLOMBIANS! You guys were still petty Cociane pushers moving under 20kilos a month LOL. Now if you would have said The Triads, MAYBE........but thats even a LONG DEBATE, but Mexicans? LAWL........bro......your not dumb as of yet very intelligent, dont make yourself seem foolish.


/CaseClosed.

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Re: THE COSA NOSTRA TODAY

Unread postby sickside » June 14th, 2010, 1:44 am

case still open buddy..lol

now you are talking about drugs when you talk about COLOMBIANS..yea maybe they help make some Mexican organizations get bigger ..but mafia..NO...Mob type shit is very different from cartels..mafia been around for a good min. before drugs truly change the game in Mexico, and for the Italians. Mafia is a way different type of business..they make money on anything..cartels try to touch every thing too, but there number one thing is the drugs..mafia taxes drugs and deal some..but don't specialize to it..mafia specialize into corruption..and corruption has been around way before any drugs. I have a lot of family from deep in Mexico ..so when they visit I ask them how is every thing down there..I always thought that the cartels were the only thing in Mexico to be DEAD HONEST!..but they talk about all this family style mob shit still down there that is fucking everything up down there..and they have been there way before cartels...but its mostly deep down in Mexico in the older areas ..not this border towns that you hear about all the time..and for sure you will hear about cartels before Mexican mafia type shit..because cartels are right at are door step in the border towns were the Mexican mob is deep down in Mexico and doesn't mess with us..they mess with there country not ours..and remember ..when I say Mexican mafia..I mean the real Mexican mafia..not the EME that America is familiar with...way different factions and don't even deal with one another..

And Mexicans were farmers before Colombians..mannnn..you talking about me sounding foolish..check your own statements before you throw a stone in a glass house....and you acting like Colombians started the drug game..now you are sounded like mayugastank (no diss mayugastank just beaning real with it)..when he talks about Italians..lol..

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Re: THE COSA NOSTRA TODAY

Unread postby youngspade » June 14th, 2010, 10:24 am

sickside wrote:case still open buddy..lol

now you are talking about drugs when you talk about COLOMBIANS..yea maybe they help make some Mexican organizations get bigger ..but mafia..NO...Mob type shit is very different from cartels..mafia been around for a good min. before drugs truly change the game in Mexico, and for the Italians. Mafia is a way different type of business..they make money on anything..cartels try to touch every thing too, but there number one thing is the drugs..mafia taxes drugs and deal some..but don't specialize to it..mafia specialize into corruption..and corruption has been around way before any drugs. I have a lot of family from deep in Mexico ..so when they visit I ask them how is every thing down there..I always thought that the cartels were the only thing in Mexico to be DEAD HONEST!..but they talk about all this family style mob shit still down there that is #%@&#%@ everything up down there..and they have been there way before cartels...but its mostly deep down in Mexico in the older areas ..not this border towns that you hear about all the time..and for sure you will hear about cartels before Mexican mafia type shit..because cartels are right at are door step in the border towns were the Mexican mob is deep down in Mexico and doesn't mess with us..they mess with there country not ours..and remember ..when I say Mexican mafia..I mean the real Mexican mafia..not the EME that America is familiar with...way different factions and don't even deal with one another..

And Mexicans were farmers before Colombians..mannnn..you talking about me sounding foolish..check your own statements before you throw a stone in a glass house....and you acting like Colombians started the drug game..now you are sounded like mayugastank (no diss mayugastank just beaning real with it)..when he talks about Italians..lol..



Yall Niggaz Was Farners My Nigga, Also, Your talking about The Italian-American crimes, which mexicans stand no chance at all against but im talking about Italy and Sicily! What? Im Black, I can never be mayugastank! Also, If it wasnt the Colombians who started The Mexicans up it damn sure wasnt the Russians, also you guys cant even compare to TheTriads, Yakuza, Russian Mafia, Hell Ill give The ALbanians would give you guys a run (Joke).

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Re: THE COSA NOSTRA TODAY

Unread postby sickside » June 14th, 2010, 2:17 pm

wait..you black..and so you think of all people you know what we were like 30 or 40 years ago or even more...right....or you could even talk on what type of business we be into....man you crazy and foolish..thats like me talking about B.G.F. or some African shit or some down south..when it comes to homeland..no race could talk on it but that race..because only that race could relate or have family to even know whats cracking..and we have no chance against the Italians..what are you talking about we kick them out of L.A. for the most part..the only ones that are here is one single family ..and that family has to deal with us thats why they have protection from us and no one else when they hit the pen...man know your info...and all the rest be in L.A. just like we be in the East Coast..LOW PRO...east coast is not are land but we make money there..the same with the others that ant brown..and how can they give us a run when they cant even find us..and if they tried..dont you think we could spot them ..some fools that ant even brown coming in your hood!..get out of here fool...shit i would say the same for blacks..if the Asians where trying to go at with the B.G.F. dont you think they would spot a chines man in CPT...come on..bud..lol...lmao...you killing me jim!...and the main reason on why I say no one can really touch us really...because this is are homeland man...we got millions!..and thousands in crime shit...how Albanians be down here, how many Russians, and so forth...Asians...naw they own there little spots..because that be there spots were there race stays together..but for the must part..CA. is a Mexican spot...down south be a black spot..shit no Albanians, Russian, or Asians be running shit in the south..hell no..know why? because thats the blacks home land for the most part...you guys got millions of people and thousands of crime fools in the mix..right or wrong man...most of the time who wins the fights..is the one who has the most members and who has home advantage..

farms!..get out of here!..lol

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Re: THE COSA NOSTRA TODAY

Unread postby youngspade » June 14th, 2010, 3:19 pm

sickside wrote:wait..you black..and so you think of all people you know what we were like 30 or 40 years ago or even more...right....or you could even talk on what type of business we be into....man you crazy and foolish..thats like me talking about B.G.F. or some African shit or some down south..when it comes to homeland..no race could talk on it but that race..because only that race could relate or have family to even know whats cracking..and we have no chance against the Italians..what are you talking about we kick them out of L.A. for the most part..the only ones that are here is one single family ..and that family has to deal with us thats why they have protection from us and no one else when they hit the pen...man know your info...and all the rest be in L.A. just like we be in the East Coast..LOW PRO...east coast is not are land but we make money there..the same with the others that ant brown..and how can they give us a run when they cant even find us..and if they tried..dont you think we could spot them ..some fools that ant even brown coming in your hood!..get out of here fool...shit i would say the same for blacks..if the Asians where trying to go at with the B.G.F. dont you think they would spot a chines man in CPT...come on..bud..lol...lmao...you killing me jim!...and the main reason on why I say no one can really touch us really...because this is are homeland man...we got millions!..and thousands in crime shit...how Albanians be down here, how many Russians, and so forth...Asians...naw they own there little spots..because that be there spots were there race stays together..but for the must part..CA. is a Mexican spot...down south be a black spot..shit no Albanians, Russian, or Asians be running shit in the south..hell no..know why? because thats the blacks home land for the most part...you guys got millions of people and thousands of crime fools in the mix..right or wrong man...most of the time who wins the fights..is the one who has the most members and who has home advantage..

farms!..get out of here!..lol



The First Line Lost Me Bro, So I didnt bother, sorry you wasted your time. But I did see, you thought I was talking about blacks than italians, The Blacks Worked with The Italians before The Colombians ring to power so what are you talking about. We Been Had Blacks "Following" in The FootSteps of The Italisna (Noticed How I worded it) WAYYYY before Mexicans were thought of in "THE WORLD".

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Re: THE COSA NOSTRA TODAY

Unread postby mayugastank » June 14th, 2010, 7:13 pm

I dont know about good relationships between blacks and italians-from what I know and read Italians hate blacks-in NYC. They do deals occassionally -shoot theres millions of blacks and italians living side by side. But during the late 80s and 90s -italians and blacks were murking eachother out in Bensonhurst and Carnarsie strong italian hoods-Reverend Al Sharpton got shanked by an italian,during some movements he was having back in the day over some black kids getting chomped up in old italian hoods-as for in the pens-the mexican mafia and italians are real close-they get their back watched by the Surenos-since most italians arent into streetfighting and are way way older then your average convict -they would be easy targets. I havent read a mafia bust were anyone under 40 was arrested-dudes getting pinched in their 70s and 80s like nothing-their mafias are way older then any in the states and they outlasted and outlived all other ethnic whites-that shit is part of their culture and their mafias go back some 500 years in some spots -the mafia of today has been around unchanged for some 200+ years so its ingrained in their culture-and shows why they have lasted so long.But blacks and italians have a bad relationship on the east coast as blacks consider them crackers and italians consider blacks moulions'....look at the bronx tale-that story was supposed to be about everyday life in the ghetto. The relationship was bad and got worse during forced busing-they had to send in the guard in boston to stop the riots between italian and black kids in schools in the 1980s. That aint ever going to change. I would compare the italian and black relationship to the chicano and black relationship except without all the violence on the level out here.

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Re: THE COSA NOSTRA TODAY

Unread postby youngspade » June 14th, 2010, 7:49 pm

mayugastank wrote:I dont know about good relationships between blacks and italians-from what I know and read Italians hate blacks-in NYC. They do deals occassionally -shoot theres millions of blacks and italians living side by side. But during the late 80s and 90s -italians and blacks were murking eachother out in Bensonhurst and Carnarsie strong italian hoods-Reverend Al Sharpton got shanked by an italian,during some movements he was having back in the day over some black kids getting chomped up in old italian hoods-as for in the pens-the mexican mafia and italians are real close-they get their back watched by the Surenos-since most italians arent into streetfighting and are way way older then your average convict -they would be easy targets. I havent read a mafia bust were anyone under 40 was arrested-dudes getting pinched in their 70s and 80s like nothing-their mafias are way older then any in the states and they outlasted and outlived all other ethnic whites-that shit is part of their culture and their mafias go back some 500 years in some spots -the mafia of today has been around unchanged for some 200+ years so its ingrained in their culture-and shows why they have lasted so long.But blacks and italians have a bad relationship on the east coast as blacks consider them crackers and italians consider blacks moulions'....look at the bronx tale-that story was supposed to be about everyday life in the ghetto. The relationship was bad and got worse during forced busing-they had to send in the guard in boston to stop the riots between italian and black kids in schools in the 1980s. That aint ever going to change. I would compare the italian and black relationship to the chicano and black relationship except without all the violence on the level out here.

''
LOl - Facrs =

http://www.trutv.com/library/crime/gang ... ngs/5.html




A Brief History
Very little is known about organized black gangs that operated in Harlem, New York, during the Prohibition and Depression years. Almost all organized crime in Harlem during that time was run by Italian, Jewish, and Irish gangsters. A few loosely run black crime factions did exist and primarily concentrated on policy and lottery gambling, prostitution and drugs.

These are the true stories of a time, a place and a people who lived during one of our countrys darkest and most socially flamboyant periods. It was the era of the flappers, jazz music, the Harlem Renaissance, bootlegged booze, speakeasies, gin joints, Tammany Hall, and the mob the crooked politicians and gangsters who ruled over it all.



William Bojangles Robinson
Americas troops were finally back from the war to end all wars. World War I was over and the country was rejoicing. The Fifth Regiment of New Yorks National Guard proudly marched down Fifth Avenue, the men rhythmically striding in perfect unison to the lilting jazz music from the military band preceding them. Thousands of people lined the way, cheering and waving flags as the troops passed through the city. Everybody was smiling. Everybody was happy and optimistic. Their husbands, fathers, brothers and sons were back. The Hell Fighters were home. A uniformed Bill Bojangles Robinson pumped his drum majors baton wildly into the air as he marched in front of Lieutenant Jim Europes all black band, leading the returning warriors back home to Harlem.

Americas returning black soldiers were sure they now would be treated as equals, having bravely proved their worth by serving honorably overseas. More than 200,000 blacks populated Harlem and more were migrating from the cotton fields and sugarcane fields of the South to join those home from the war. The hope was that they all would find better paying work, better housing and equality. It did not take long for them all to realize that America had not changed. The whites only system was still solidly in place, and was steadily growing worse on a daily basis. The only work they found available were low-paying, menial jobs as janitors, servants, bootblacks, cooks, houseboys and baggage handlers; to name a few. These positions hardly paid them enough to live on and much less than any white person was paid for doing the same work. The doors to the good jobs were shut in their faces and they were dared to step out of line, under threat of severe repercussions. A few enterprising people did manage to open some nightclubs, restaurants and taverns that catered to Harlems black population.


Queenie and Bumpy
Stephanie St. Clair was a black French woman from Martinique, who immigrated to America in 1912 via Marseilles, France. In 1922, St. Clair took $10,000 of her own money and opened up a numbers bank in Harlem. She became known as Queenie, throughout Manhattan, but the people of Harlem referred to her respectfully as Madame St. Clair.

Queenie was a tall, abrasive and tough woman, with a seldom-seen gentle side, who ran the famous New York extortion gang known as The Forty Thieves. The Forty Thieves had a reputation of being so tough that even the white gangsters would not interfere with their illegal operations, or attempt to take over their turf. The gang had been around since the 19th Century and was predominantly white. Queenies infiltrating such an established, well-known gang gives credit to her persuasive powers and leadership abilities. It did not take long for her to spin off from the gang and strike out on her own. She utilized her experience and talents to set up operations as a policy banker and recruited some of Harlems blacks to support her and her growing numbers game. Within a year she was worth more than $500,000 with more than 40 runners and 10 comptrollers in her charge.

One of Queenies main recruits was a colorful character from Charleston, S.C., named Ellsworth Raymond Johnson. He had moved to Harlem with his parents when he was a small boy and was given the nickname, Bumpy, because of a large bump on the back of his head. He was a dapper gangster who always made it a point to wear the latest and best clothes and to flash a wad of cash wherever he went. Bumpy was a pimp, burglar and stickup man who possessed a recalcitrant attitude. He always carried a knife and gun, neither of which he was hesitant to use. All too often Bumpy ended up in barroom clashes over the slightest of issues. He feared nobody and did not shy from confrontations. Helen Lawrenson, in her book Stranger at the Party, remarked on Bumpys short fuse and arrogance. He never learned, however, to curb his temper or to bow his head to any man, She wrote. His negative demeanor led to his spending almost half of his life in prisons before he even reached age 30. During his interments he became an avid reader and began writing poetry. Bumpy also proved to be an incorrigible prisoner and spent one-third of a 10-year sentence in solitary confinement. Because of his attitude, he was shuttled from prison to prison until his release in 1932. When he got out he was broke and looking for work.

Despite his tough-guy reputation, Bumpy Johnson had a soft side. It was common knowledge among Harlemites that he had often helped many of Harlems poor with secret cash donations and gifts. Queenie St. Clair liked what she saw in Bumpy, and offered him a position as henchman in her numbers racket. Always the dandy, looking for better opportunities to make more money, Bumpy joined Queenies ranks and quickly gained her trust. One of his first tasks was to confront the Bub Hewlett gang. It erupted into one of Harlems most violent and bloody gang wars. Eventually, Bumpy gained the edge and defeated Hewlett, temporarily saving the numbers game from the Mobs first takeover attempt.



Lawrence Fishburn played Bumpy Johnson in the movie Hoodlum

The relationship between Queenie and Bumpy was strange from the beginning. Some said they had an ongoing affair and others claimed that the odd couple was only a business partnership. Bumpy never abandoned his pimping and robbery professions, both of which irritated Queenie. Still, it made no difference. Both knew what would make the numbers game a success and began expanding operations. Their expansion efforts did not go unobserved by the powers-at-large.

Lenox Avenue in Harlem, 1927


The housing situation grew worse. Estimates placed more than 5,000 people residing in a single block. Harlem was a severely overcrowded and segregated community, with more than 250,000 citizens crammed into an area 50 blocks long and eight blocks wide. Many of these people had to sleep in shifts. One would return from work to sleep, while another would vacate the bed to go to work. The bed would always remain warm for its next occupant. Many of the Harlemites could barely scrape together enough money to pay rent. This led to what became known as rent parties, which were commonly held on weekends to raise enough money to pay the landlord. If the rent was not paid by Sunday, the tenant would find their belongings thrown out on the streets.

Times were hard for black people, not only in Harlem but throughout the nation. Race riots and labor riots were erupting everywhere. Racism was the rule and malcontent was the order of the day. In the midst of these conflicts, the nation was entering into the throes of Prohibition. On January 20, 1920, Congress passed the 18th Amendment to the Constitution, banning the sale of alcoholic beverages. Harlem establishments that depended on the sale of alcohol were forced out of business, as were others across the nation. These disrupting events marked the beginning of the Roaring Twenties.










Sorry I gotta habit of ignoring your points! Exucse me, too much BS too me, im high!


No offense!

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Re: THE COSA NOSTRA TODAY

Unread postby youngspade » June 14th, 2010, 8:01 pm

Now That Kills You off On Black Organized Crime! Now,

Italians, These were the FIRST SECRET SOCETIES aka Mafias to BE Of EXISTANCE!

Why are you damn MEXICANS so fucking ignorant LOL!! For instance, why was a Man from IRAQ even took after Italian mafia ways,



Jan 9, 2004 ... "Between the Mafia and Joseph Stalin. What was, is, Saddam Hussein like? It is worth recalling,"

Jul 24, 2009 ... "Saddam Hussein facts, Biographical data of Saddam Hussein. ... and would gain the nickname "Tikriti mafia"

Feb 22, 2010 ..." He was at the center, a yellow dot labeled "Saddam Hussein. ... (It didn't hurt, though, that one influential officer—Maj. ... As the Saddam social network came together, it started looking a lot like the New York Mafia"

He wasnt trynna be a Mexican Mafia Member!


Back To The Subject, Italians, Triads Camora Started FIRST!''


http://www.gangresearch.net/Archives/UI ... hrash.html


The word "gang" comes from "gonge," a term originally meaning a journey, but later referring to a "gonge" of sailors in the fifteenth century. "Gangs" of outlaws or wild young men came into common usage by Shakespeare's time. The "Father of Gang Research," Frederic Thrasher, gave the word its industrial-era meaning in the 1920s and made “gang” into a term which meant kids of the street. But US gangs had other predecessors than unsupervised street urchins.

There are four kinds of "gangs" which were predecessors of the street gangs of today. 1. Secret Societies; 2. Gangs of Outlaws in the Wild West; 3.Racist gangs like the Klu Klux Klan; and 4. "Voting Gangs" tied mainly to the Democratic Party in large cities.








///CASECLOSED



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Re: THE COSA NOSTRA TODAY

Unread postby youngspade » June 14th, 2010, 8:05 pm

1. SECRET SOCIETIES

Two Secret Societies are especially important for US gangs, as well as gangs around the world. Both the Chinese Triads and the Italian Mafia and Camorra have existed at least since the early 1800s.



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Re: THE COSA NOSTRA TODAY

Unread postby mayugastank » June 15th, 2010, 4:42 am

youngspade wrote:
1. SECRET SOCIETIES

Two Secret Societies are especially important for US gangs, as well as gangs around the world. Both the Chinese Triads and the Italian Mafia and Camorra have existed at least since the early 1800s.



Add that

High Momment



Are you kidding me? TRIADS.....please! They arent even secret and since when have they been involved in anything? From what I have read they number in the twenty thousands yet despite this -they arent really involved in much? definetly not in europe and definetly not in the states! The yukuza another organization whom people think are secret and have history are a loose collection of gangs who got their start after WW2. Dont believe the hype! The Camorra and the italian mafia are one in the same -both were started by sicilians-the camorra are an italian gang. Also the biggest -names in Europe are either usually of Italian descent or have a history to sicily-in France at on epoint

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Re: THE COSA NOSTRA TODAY

Unread postby youngspade » June 15th, 2010, 10:31 am

mayugastank wrote:
youngspade wrote:
1. SECRET SOCIETIES

Two Secret Societies are especially important for US gangs, as well as gangs around the world. Both the Chinese Triads and the Italian Mafia and Camorra have existed at least since the early 1800s.



Add that

High Momment



Are you kidding me? TRIADS.....please! They arent even secret and since when have they been involved in anything? From what I have read they number in the twenty thousands yet despite this -they arent really involved in much? definetly not in europe and definetly not in the states! The yukuza another organization whom people think are secret and have history are a loose collection of gangs who got their start after WW2. Dont believe the hype! The Camorra and the italian mafia are one in the same -both were started by sicilians-the camorra are an italian gang. Also the biggest -names in Europe are either usually of Italian descent or have a history to sicily-in France at on epoint



Whateva you say Triads were before The Mexican MAfia LOL

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Re: THE COSA NOSTRA TODAY

Unread postby Tre » August 6th, 2011, 11:50 pm

thewestside wrote:I have to agree with this as well. Those Mexican gangs don't go back that far. The only ones still around that could be said to go back to the early 20th century are the Italians and the Chinese.

mayugastank wrote: Mexican gangs in the USA are the oldest gangs --do some research your talking about the gangs of East La arent that old ---please! Most the gangs of ELA go back to 1920......not just some or a few MOST!! Their is not one gang in EAST LA that isnt older then 1940.This isnt chicago or nyc were gangs fade away -gangs out here have history why you think we have that gang problem here unlike the rest of the states?

HERES ONE GANG EXTREMELY ACTIVE TODAY>They started in the early 1900s and are around bigger then they used to be. WESTSIDE DONT SPEAK ON WHAT YOU DONT KNOW.

Founded in the 1920s, the 38th Street gang dates back to the pachucos and zoot suits and was formed in the borderline between South Central and the City of Vernon. They received media attention in the 1940s as a result of the "Sleepy Lagoon Murder" and trial. Several members were arrested and convicted of the murder of José Díaz.[1][2] On October 4, 1943, the convictions of the gang members were overturned and the gang members were allegedly welcomed back to their communities as heroes.[2][3] Shortly after "Sleepy Lagoon", the newspapers were said to have exaggerated the headlines about the gang that wore zoot suits and created war-time hysteria and prejudice against the Mexican-American community. Many Mexican-Americans from the segregated parts of town were attacked by sailors and members of other branches of the United States military. The military personnel felt Zoot Suiters were not contributing to the war effort and were wasting valuable resources by dressing so flamboyant, innocent hispanic civilians were also attacked by the sailors without provocation. After the riots and because of international criticism the city council adopted a resolution that banned the wearing of zoot suits on Los Angeles streets. It also banned sailors from going to Los Angeles on leave.[2]38th street is often credited for starting a new style of dress; during the time the sleepy lagoon defendants were incarcerated they were given over sized clothing to be made fun off by anglo inmates and prison staff. However, instead, they maintained their clothing well cleaned and ironed, this is the dress style that gangmembers being wearing ever since.


Wow... just write black people out of your history! No biggie we are use to the constant rewriting of history to exclude black folks... but some shit is just so blatant?? To even suggest that the zoot suit had no history until white inmates and the prison staff gods bestowed upon the Mexican people baggy clothing aka zoot suits?? ... that's just some funny shit Mayuga!

Just to bring balance to this thread. There were few Chicanos in 1940 Los Angeles. Most Chicanos had been deported against their will to Mexico under the Mexican Repatriation Act of the 1930s. So the larger population consisted of mostly blacks and whites. Blacks in those days was sympathetic toward Chicanos viewing them as a disenfranchised group being railroaded by a racist American justice system. This is evident when you go through black newspapers during that same period which all openly supported 38th street aka the Sleepy lagoon defendants. Not only did black newspapers like the Chicago Defender and California Eagle openly support and publicize the injustice of the trial, but black churches and organizations like the Urban League helped raise money to fund the appellate process for the twelve.

Image

The 1940's was a different time altogether Mayuga. It's not like today where you have black and Mexican youth proudly proclaiming themselves as gang members?? Black and Mexican youth in the 1940's didn't like being stereotyped by the white newspapers and cops as thugs and hoodlums. So much of your bolstering about being the oldest gang is not going to resonate with blacks. Any group challenging white authority was labeled a 'gang' in those days.

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Re: THE COSA NOSTRA TODAY

Unread postby mayugastank » August 9th, 2011, 7:45 pm

Such as white fence/maravilla/jardin/opal/soto/gaherty/bassett/black diamonds/canta rana/dogtown/clover/ in Los Angelos alone who are 30-40 years OLDER THEN ZOOTSUITS!

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Re: THE COSA NOSTRA TODAY

Unread postby policyking52 » August 15th, 2011, 7:30 am

mayugastank wrote:I recently read a book on an FBI agent who infiltrate the mob (GAMBINOS) Title : The MAking of Jack Falcone.

It was a sad face to the present day COSA NOSTRA, they actually seemed Pathetic, kinda like the most minor street gangs in LA. Many of the new made members were described as junkies, has beens, and most were said to not have even committed a murder for the LCN. The man the book centered around Greg Depalma, was a 2-bit hoodlum. He dealed in stolen water and pirated DVDS, his income was meager about 2000 bucks a month. This man got out of the Feds and was put in a high position because of the simple lack of personnel the mafia had. THE WESTSIDE * previous estimates on membership put the Gambinos at 200+ men, I just dont understand how so many guys could be MADE* and have such a disgraceful and petty LCN in New York? There were a few instances of were things looked organized (offshore gambling, medicare fraud) but most the stuff the new members were involved in was streetgang like, home invasions of drug connections, selling drugs and doing as much as they sold. The book quotes Greg Depalma and most other old school mafiosi as voicing their loud displeasure at the new membership. Can anyone shed some light on the new members? and is it true that they dress like NYC blacks**quote acting capo ROBERT VACCARO?.........the book mentioned the lack of italian people in NYC in general for teh poor state of the Mafia.


The Cosa Nostra is a dying breed not just in NY but across the country. Between law enforcement, new ethnic crime organizations and internal wars between families and within families LCN is just a shadow of it's former self. They had their time just like the Jews and the Irish did and they had to give it up to the Italians, not the Italians have to step aside.

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Re: THE COSA NOSTRA TODAY

Unread postby thewestside » August 15th, 2011, 11:59 am

policyking52 wrote:The Cosa Nostra is a dying breed not just in NY but across the country. Between law enforcement, new ethnic crime organizations and internal wars between families and within families LCN is just a shadow of it's former self. They had their time just like the Jews and the Irish did and they had to give it up to the Italians, not the Italians have to step aside.


In the west and in the south the Cosa Nostra is no longer a factor. Pretty much the midwest as well, except for Chicago. But it still has a strong presence in the northeast, particularly in the New York metropolitan area, and to a lesser extent in New England, parts of New Jersey, and Philadelphia; as well as south Florida where the NY families still operate. For the Italians, "stepping aside" has been a slower process than many thought.

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Re: THE COSA NOSTRA TODAY

Unread postby mayugastank » August 17th, 2011, 11:24 am

thewestside wrote:
policyking52 wrote:The Cosa Nostra is a dying breed not just in NY but across the country. Between law enforcement, new ethnic crime organizations and internal wars between families and within families LCN is just a shadow of it's former self. They had their time just like the Jews and the Irish did and they had to give it up to the Italians, not the Italians have to step aside.


In the west and in the south the Cosa Nostra is no longer a factor. Pretty much the midwest as well, except for Chicago. But it still has a strong presence in the northeast, particularly in the New York metropolitan area, and to a lesser extent in New England, parts of New Jersey, and Philadelphia; as well as south Florida where the NY families still operate. For the Italians, "stepping aside" has been a slower process than many thought.




That theyve lasted this long shows how much teh culture of Mafia is involved and intertwined with Italian culture in general. I doubt any other ethnic group in America couldve lasted that long without completely assimilating...shoot even the japanese orientals of the 1950s have been assimilated into the melting pot. Ive never taken away from what Italians are or did....they really set the pattern for most other ethnic groups.....but the Roman culture is also in excess of thousands of years and has had a modern historically documented culture longer then any other people in America.

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Re: THE COSA NOSTRA TODAY

Unread postby talkreal » November 14th, 2011, 6:57 pm

New Orleans Has a New Boss

Michael Tufaro seems to have taken control of the New Orleans Mafia along with his brother Joseph "Joey" Tufaro. The Tufaro brothers have a five decade family history in the New Orleans Mob. They also have family ties to the New York Colombo Family that go back to the 80's. Here are a few links and some other infomation that supports this line of thinking.

http://www.gangsterbb.net/threads/ubbth ... ber=614116
http://moagnyc.org/home/13-italian-gang ... ime-family
http://neworleansmafia.blogspot.com/
^ OPCSO.orgmichaeltufarocase#286666
http://www.stbclerk.commichaeltufarocase#131364
^ 04/10/1988,04/23/1988michaeltufarogooglenewsarcives.com
^ OPCSO.orgdocketmastermichaeltufarocase#415860#415877
^ http://www.nytimes.com/.../the-ciy-drug ... -term.html
^ www2.stpgov.org/agenda/04aug/Appeal6.pdf
^ http://www.nola.com/news/index.ssf/2009 ... s_mis.html

mayugastank wrote:
thewestside wrote:
policyking52 wrote:The Cosa Nostra is a dying breed not just in NY but across the country. Between law enforcement, new ethnic crime organizations and internal wars between families and within families LCN is just a shadow of it's former self. They had their time just like the Jews and the Irish did and they had to give it up to the Italians, not the Italians have to step aside.


In the west and in the south the Cosa Nostra is no longer a factor. Pretty much the midwest as well, except for Chicago. But it still has a strong presence in the northeast, particularly in the New York metropolitan area, and to a lesser extent in New England, parts of New Jersey, and Philadelphia; as well as south Florida where the NY families still operate. For the Italians, "stepping aside" has been a slower process than many thought.




That theyve lasted this long shows how much teh culture of Mafia is involved and intertwined with Italian culture in general. I doubt any other ethnic group in America couldve lasted that long without completely assimilating...shoot even the japanese orientals of the 1950s have been assimilated into the melting pot. Ive never taken away from what Italians are or did....they really set the pattern for most other ethnic groups.....but the Roman culture is also in excess of thousands of years and has had a modern historically documented culture longer then any other people in America.


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