End of The Colombo and Bonano Families?

American organized crime groups included traditional groups such as La Cosa Nostra & the Italian Mafia to modern groups such as Black Mafia Family. Discuss the most organized criminal groups in the United States including gangs in Canada.
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End of The Colombo and Bonano Families?

Unread post by mayugastank » July 26th, 2010, 4:15 pm

Colombo mobster Michael (Mickey) Souza, The Don of Screwups, now begging for witness protection
July 20, 2010 by Capo · 15 Comments



- Michael (Mickey) Souza -
The Colombo crime family must really be going to the dogs if this is the type of muscle they’re recruiting.

Meet Michael (Mickey) Souza.

Before legendary Colombo underboss John (Sonny) Franzese pricked Souza’s finger with a sterile diabetic needle in 2005 to make him a made man, Souza had built quite the fiasco-filled résumé.

There was the time he shot himself, Plaxico Burress-style, while tucking a handgun in his sweatpants. There’s his arrest for boating while drunk. And then there was the time he injured one of his fellow goons while the two busted up a funeral parlor.

If an organization is no better than its worst guy, then the Colombos are indeed in trouble.

And what thanks do they get for taking in this mopey mobster? He’s now turned stool pigeon.

Souza, 42, made his debut on the witness stand last week at the racketeering trial of Genovese gangster Anthony Antico in Brooklyn Federal Court.

He was facing 30 years to life for drug trafficking when he sought a cooperation agreement from the feds.

“‘Hello, John,’” he wrote to John Buretta, the chief of the Brooklyn U.S. attorney’s organized-crime section, in 2008, offering to help “seal up” some federal cases.

“P.S. I am so ready to go to [the witness protection program] … can’t do this anymore,” Souza concluded.

His testimony – and dramatic turn against the bosses – speaks to the Colombos’ disarray and lowering of standards for supposed “men of honor.”

“Their [the Colombos'] roster is getting pretty thin,” conceded a law enforcement official.

Souza’s troubles go way back.

He was “honorably discharged” from high school because “I baseball-batted somebody on school property,” he testified. He instead graduated to loansharking, drug dealing and running a Staten Island gym called Evolution, where wiseguys and wanna-bes pumped iron.

And after assaulting his own wife, he was marked for death by his mobbed-up father-in-law.

But maybe worst of all was violating a previously unknown rule by exposing himself in a Staten Island bar owned by a gangster.

“You know, the rules, you don’t take out your private part in a wiseguy’s place,” Souza said on the stand, in describing his past with the mob.

In Souza’s bizarro world, “sitdowns” to settle beefs are now called “standups” – “you talk on the corner.” And he paid the medical bills for a guy whose eye he popped out during a grisly fight.

But Souza said he sees the Mafia more clearly now. “There’s no honor in this life. It’s all about the dollar,” he said.

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Re: End of The Colombo and Bonano Families?

Unread post by mayugastank » July 26th, 2010, 4:18 pm

Both The Bonanos and Colombos have had top tier leaders flip. The Bonanos have been charectarized as of late as being a street gang and less of a mafia. The colombos are making guys like the one above and rats and snitches for the Bonanaos are the majority. Joe Massino- Sal Vitale -both the top leaders -turned informant. Dozens of unsolved murders and conspiracys were solved due to them. 75 bonano members have been convicted. The FBI has dismantled their bonano task force.Anyone care to add to this or discount me?

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Re: End of The Colombo and Bonano Families?

Unread post by Azure9920 » July 26th, 2010, 4:24 pm

Both families are in disarray, but both are still some of the top organized crime groups on the East Coast and far from finished.

The Colombos have had the much worst of the two, with their dysfunction dating back decades, however the problems of the Bonanno's are relatively new. The organizational structure of LCN basically prevents a single bust from dismantling the group, instead LE chips away slowly. They may have fallen quite a ways from the 60's, but LCN isn't finished in NYC by a long shot.

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Re: End of The Colombo and Bonano Families?

Unread post by mayugastank » July 26th, 2010, 4:27 pm

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

BY GREG B. SMITH
DAILY NEWS STAFF WRITER


The story of the Bonanno crime family already is the stuff of Hollywood best sellers. The family patriarch, Joseph Bonanno, was the model for Don Corleone in Mario Puzo's "The Godfather." FBI Agent Joseph Pistone's daring infiltration of the Bonannos led to "Donnie Brasco."

Now the Corleone family is back in "The Godfather Returns," a novel by Mark Winegardner that has gotten tepid reviews.

Perhaps Winegardner should have consulted Frank Lino, the man whose FBI confessions are the real book on the Bonannos.

At the end of his long Mafia career, Frank (Curly) Lino faced a terrible dilemma - die in prison or turn on his own son and his extended mob family.

He decided prison was not an option.

Lino became an FBI informant, spilling his guts on the son, Joseph, and several cousins - as well as his Bonanno buddies.

The result: A 200-plus page chronicle of a crime family whose real-life exploits are as bloody, bizarre and captivating as any work of fiction.

Over the course of a year, Lino, 67, spent hours at undisclosed locations telling all to FBI Agents Christine Grubert and Jay Kramer. The agents' notes, obtained by the Daily News, offer a glimpse into mob life - as well as a litany of betrayals.

All in the family

Frank Lino took the agents back to his childhood on W. Eighth St. in 1950s Gravesend, Brooklyn, where the mob was as much a part of life as Spaldeens and the Dodgers.

Lino made it only to 10th grade at Lafayette High School before dropping out to hijack trucks with a mob farm team known as the Avenue U Boys.

After impressing local wiseguys, Lino was inducted into the Bonanno crime family on his 40th birthday, Oct. 30, 1977.

It was a natural progression for a son of a family long shadowed by the Mafia.

Lino's parents' marriage was arranged in the '30s by the boss of the Genovese crime family.

Cousin Eddie Lino was a Gambino crime family soldier. Cousin Bobby Lino Sr., a Bonanno soldier, insisted on his deathbed that his son, Robert Jr., become a soldier, too.

Frank told the FBI that his own son, Joseph, followed the same path, becoming a soldier in his crew.

Then Frank Lino proceeded to implicate all of the La Cosa Nostra Linos.

He told the FBI about his son the loanshark and extortionist.

He described how his son's bus company, Streetsmart Transportation, linked up with a Bonanno-controlled union so it could come in low on public bids.

He even called Joseph unlucky, stating he "is a big gambler and has lost a significant amount of money."

Sometimes Lino used the mob to protect his own. In 1980, he learned that a Colombo associate, Michael (Mikey Bear) Aiello, sold drugs to a cousin, Grace Ann Lino.

He says he sought and received permission to kill the associate, and watched as Aiello was shot on Ocean Parkway. Somehow Mikey Bear survived.

Donnie Brasco Donnybrook

Then there was his family's involvement in the Donnie Brasco fiasco.

Dominick (Sonny Black) Napolitano, a trusted Bonanno capo, made a mistake that would cost him his life: He brought FBI Agent Joseph Pistone - aka Donnie Brasco - into the family.

Before dying, Napolitano said, "Hit me one more time, make it good," as he lay wounded.

When Lino learned that mob associate Ronnie Filicomo had assigned Lino's son, Joseph, to dig a hole for Sonny Black, he got "angry at Filicomo for soliciting his son's participation in the plan and for not asking [Lino's] permission."

Lino later confronted his son, who admitted he dug the hole. But on the night of the murder, the killers could not find the hole and dumped the body under some rocks.

And for the Bonanno family, getting rid of a corpse proved harder than creating one on more than one occasion.

On the night of a May 1992 slaying of a suspected mob turncoat, Lino left the getaway car on the street around the corner from the spot where the victim was to be dispatched - a bar above a nail salon in Bensonhurst.

Lino entered the bar after the associate had been shot in the head. To make sure the victim was dead, one of Lino's cleanup crew stuck an icepick in the victim's ear.

The body was wrapped in a rug and then Lino stood outside, making sure no one exited a nearby subway. In the dark, they brought the body down.

The carefully parked getaway car would not start. The gang then scrambled around with a very bulky rug in the dark to find another car that would.

The Drunk Who Couldn't Shoot Straight

There were the odd times when Lino tried to play the Mafia version of pacifist.

Bobby Lino Sr. once really wanted to kill associate William (Cappy) Capparelli for allegedly extorting a Lino relative. He even got permission from the bosses to carry out the hit.

But Frank Lino "put a stop to killing Capparelli, saying it was not right to kill a person over such an argument."

Once, a crew member known as Patty Muscles infuriated the Colombo family by shooting at that family's acting boss.

Lino explained that Patty was too drunk to recognize whom he was shooting at, so the Colombo gangsters reasoned that Patty deserved only a broken arm.

But Lino outsmarted the Colombos: He sent Patty Muscles to a hospital where the family knew people who would put a fake cast on his arm.

Lino was consistently practical. During an internal Bonanno war in the early 1980s, he feared getting whacked, so he insisted on meeting fellow gangsters beyond the metal detectors at Kennedy Airport's Delta Terminal.

That way, nobody could bring a gun.

Pitching Stories

Many of Lino's statements to the FBI were instrumental in the successful Brooklyn federal prosecution of Bonanno family boss Joseph Massino, who was found guilty of seven murders.

But not everything Lino told the FBI has led to arrests - even though it makes for interesting reading.

Lino claimed that Mets pitcher John Franco got him and other mobsters free tickets to a Mets game in Montreal - even allowing crime figures to visit him in the clubhouse at times.

In a statement, Franco declined to address "the specifics" but said he is "proud to be an Italian-American."

While in Canada, Lino claims he met Alfonso Gagliano, a former minister in Canada's cabinet. At the meeting, Lino contends Bonanno gangster Joseph Lopresti introduced Gagliano to him as a made man in the family.

Gagliano vehemently denied Lino's allegation - which was first revealed in The News last week.

Gagliano was dismissed as ambassador in February after his name surfaced in a corruption scandal.

The Sins of the Father

So far, Joseph Lino has not been charged, and sources speculated that the father agreed to cooperate only if the son would be spared.

But two weeks ago, cousin Robert Lino Jr., 38, was not so lucky. A judge sentenced him to 27 years in federal prison based in large part on Frank Lino's testimony.

"The betrayal of your family is the worst thing you can do in your life," said a Lino cousin shortly after Robert Lino got his heavy-duty prison sentence. "There is nothing worse that I can think of."

Originally published on November 22, 2004
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Re: End of The Colombo and Bonano Families?

Unread post by mayugastank » July 26th, 2010, 4:35 pm

Azure9920 wrote:Both families are in disarray, but both are still some of the top organized crime groups on the East Coast and far from finished.

The Colombos have had the much worst of the two, with their dysfunction dating back decades, however the problems of the Bonanno's are relatively new. The organizational structure of LCN basically prevents a single bust from dismantling the group, instead LE chips away slowly. They may have fallen quite a ways from the 60's, but LCN isn't finished in NYC by a long shot.

didnt say they were. I do state that the bonanaos have been called a disorganized crime family. They have hardly any new members being made and those that do -end up testifying quite quickly. Teh entire leadership of the Bonanos turned states evidence. The don testified that he ordered people to kill other people. Their entire mebership roster is known. Every Single bonano soldier is known to the FBI . Their new leaders were done in by their old leaders. Since 2004 , almost every soldier convicted has turned states evidence. This guy above is the new breed of mobster they are left to "make"/ its not unresoanble to suggest they are finito!....never in their history have they ever been in this position. The reason they were able to survive before was due to lax law enforcement. Peopel werent as likely to quit if they were only fighting a few years. The sentences have changed the game. The last Bonano bust had menin their 70s getting rolled up. Their is no new blood. No new recruits and hardly any Italian neighborhoods in America left. Staten Island-Bensonhurst-.....are the only 2 that come to mind on the entire East Coast. On the west and throughout middle America...their arent any strong italian neighborhoods at all...not a one! You may have a sprinkling of italians here and there but not a single city or neighborhood were italian immigration is even a factor. The italian mafia is dead due to a lack of italians!

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Re: End of The Colombo and Bonano Families?

Unread post by Faciulina » July 26th, 2010, 4:45 pm

Since 2004 , almost every soldier convicted has turned states evidence
lol, absolutely fake
Their is no new blood. No new recruits and hardly any Italian neighborhoods in America left. Staten Island-Bensonhurst-.....are the only 2 that come to mind on the entire East Coast
are you kidding me? you forgot long island, westchester, large parts of bronx and queens, and larger parts of jersey are litterally full of italians

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Re: End of The Colombo and Bonano Families?

Unread post by Azure9920 » July 26th, 2010, 4:50 pm

mayugastank wrote:I do state that the bonanaos have been called a disorganized crime family. They have hardly any new members being made and those that do -end up testifying quite quickly.
That's not true. The Bonnano's have had less than 10 members rat in the entire history of their organization, and while all of them have happened quite recently, its hardly the flipping spree you try to make it look like.
Their entire mebership roster is known. Every Single bonano soldier is known to the FBI .


Just as the same for every other LCN family, and just about every major criminal organization operating in the US.
Since 2004 , almost every soldier convicted has turned states evidence.
This is incorrect information, you have no clue what you're talking about.
The italian mafia is dead due to a lack of italians!
And yet the FBI still regards them as their top investigative priority, I guess the Italian mafia has a case of the living dead then?

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Re: End of The Colombo and Bonano Families?

Unread post by mayugastank » July 26th, 2010, 7:22 pm

Azure9920 wrote:
mayugastank wrote:I do state that the bonanaos have been called a disorganized crime family. They have hardly any new members being made and those that do -end up testifying quite quickly.
That's not true. The Bonnano's have had less than 10 members rat in the entire history of their organization, and while all of them have happened quite recently, its hardly the flipping spree you try to make it look like.
Their entire mebership roster is known. Every Single bonano soldier is known to the FBI .


Just as the same for every other LCN family, and just about every major criminal organization operating in the US.
Since 2004 , almost every soldier convicted has turned states evidence.
This is incorrect information, you have no clue what you're talking about.
The italian mafia is dead due to a lack of italians!
And yet the FBI still regards them as their top investigative priority, I guess the Italian mafia has a case of the living dead then?




10 made soldiers flip and countless associates...In one indictment 15 bonanao/soldiers and associates testified for the prosecution ...thus the overwhelming numbers forced the very boss to flip himself. Their is virtually nothing that isnt known about the bonanos...you paint 10 soldiers as being a low number but they have all come back to back....75 bonanaos have been convicted recently not to mention....the total associate count probably in the 3 dozen range who testified in several trials. Also teh underboss and boss of the family for the last 25 years....I mean what have they done that they didnt get caught for?

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Re: End of The Colombo and Bonano Families?

Unread post by mayugastank » July 26th, 2010, 8:08 pm

Also Faculina take note that I said Colombo and Bonano families and not Gambino and Genovese. Should the lucchese be included

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Re: End of The Colombo and Bonano Families?

Unread post by thewestside » July 26th, 2010, 10:57 pm

mayugastank wrote:Both The Bonanos and Colombos have had top tier leaders flip. The Bonanos have been charectarized as of late as being a street gang and less of a mafia. The colombos are making guys like the one above and rats and snitches for the Bonanaos are the majority. Joe Massino- Sal Vitale -both the top leaders -turned informant. Dozens of unsolved murders and conspiracys were solved due to them. 75 bonano members have been convicted. The FBI has dismantled their bonano task force.Anyone care to add to this or discount me?
You have a habit of reading something and then coming on this forum and saying stupid stuff. I'm starting to wonder if you do it just to get attention. First, rats are not the "majority" for any family. They simply get the most attention. Even today, far more mob guys keep their mouths shut and do their time than become rats. Out of the thousands of mob members over the years, less than 100 are known to have officially flipped. It's just that the majority of them have come in the last couple decades. But even now they are still very much the minority. Second, dozens of unsolved murders have not been solved due to the flipping of Massino and Vitale. Not even close. Third, over the past decade over 70 Bonanno members and associates have been convicted; not just members. Fourth, back during the early 1990's the FBI combined it's Bonanno squad and Colombo squad into one. But that resulted in the Bonannos making a strong come back, which the FBI has had to address in recent years. As a result, the FBI has separate squads for each of the five New York families. What has changed is the size of the squads since the FBI had to redistribute it's resources since 9/11. During the 1980's and 1990's there were about 350 FBI agents working full or part time on mob cases in New York. Today there are about 50 or so.
mayugastank wrote:didnt say they were. I do state that the bonanaos have been called a disorganized crime family. They have hardly any new members being made and those that do -end up testifying quite quickly. Teh entire leadership of the Bonanos turned states evidence. The don testified that he ordered people to kill other people. Their entire mebership roster is known. Every Single bonano soldier is known to the FBI . Their new leaders were done in by their old leaders. Since 2004 , almost every soldier convicted has turned states evidence. This guy above is the new breed of mobster they are left to "make"/ its not unresoanble to suggest they are finito!....never in their history have they ever been in this position. The reason they were able to survive before was due to lax law enforcement. Peopel werent as likely to quit if they were only fighting a few years. The sentences have changed the game. The last Bonano bust had menin their 70s getting rolled up. Their is no new blood. No new recruits and hardly any Italian neighborhoods in America left. Staten Island-Bensonhurst-.....are the only 2 that come to mind on the entire East Coast. On the west and throughout middle America...their arent any strong italian neighborhoods at all...not a one! You may have a sprinkling of italians here and there but not a single city or neighborhood were italian immigration is even a factor. The italian mafia is dead due to a lack of italians!
Now I'm convinced you're just trying to get attention. First, where do you get the idea that the Bonannos have hardly any new members being made? That isn't true. Nor is it for the Colombos or any of the other New York families. They routinely make new members for ones that have died plus, traditionally, two additional ones at Christmas. But they aren't allowed to replace guys that flip. Second, while the Bonannos have had a lot of top guys flip, the whole point of a crime family is a continuing criminal enterprise that is able to fill those positions and keep functioning. The organization is not dependent on one man, even the boss or underboss. Third, the FBI has known of most mob members for years now. That's nothing new. Fourth, now you're throwing that 70 figure out again. If you add up all the Bonanno members and associates that have been convicted or made plea deals over the last decade, it's over 70. But keep in mind that plea deals usually result in shorter sentences and some of those guys are already out. The last bust involving the Bonnannos was in February, in which 9 guys from the Bonanno and Lucchese families were indicted. If you're talking about the last big bust involving the Bonanno family alone, that was last October when 15 members and associates were indicted. Fifth, general attrition, or "no new blood" as you call it, is certainly a factor in the demise of the mob. It's why many of the smaller families are now gone. However the families in New York have always had a larger pool to recruit from. It's why 70% of the remaining mob membership belongs to the five New York famiiles. 85% if you include the rest of the northeast.
Azure9920 wrote:That's not true. The Bonnano's have had less than 10 members rat in the entire history of their organization, and while all of them have happened quite recently, its hardly the flipping spree you try to make it look like.


The Bonannos have actually had 13 members flip.
mayugastank wrote:Also Faculina take note that I said Colombo and Bonano families and not Gambino and Genovese. Should the lucchese be included
Though they do not have the size or presence they once did, the New York families are still very much alive and active with formal structures in place. The Genovese and Gambino families have about 200 members each and the Lucchese, Colombo, and Bonanno families have a little over 100 members each. It would be accurate to say that some families in other parts of the country have been reduced to a street gang, if not disappeared altogether, but not in New York.

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Re: End of The Colombo and Bonano Families?

Unread post by mayugastank » July 27th, 2010, 12:06 am

So what really did I say that was wrong here? 13 members flipped...quite high...the top leadership flipped . Their isnt anything the FBI doesnt know about the bonanos going back to at least the 1970s....The guys who flipped were top tier guys at least since the 1980s. You throw out a 100 to make it sound good! But others like raab....quote say they are under 60...and going fast! The FBI has labeled then not an organized crime group....saying that it was a stretch to name a group of ragtag hoodlums a mafia.EXACT WORDS. Now as for what constitutes the Bonanos in the last 2 decades its in complete disarray YET you continue to inflate and create puffery to stretch 2 familys( GAMBINO-GENOVESE) into 5......The truth is that the Bonanos-Lucchese-Colombos -have never in their history been targeted at the level they have and that the sentences are commiserate with the amount of informers. I am not totally sure but I do believe that a big percent of their informers came in the last decade. Their top guys have flipped in droves bringing convictions in the 75 range....as far as associates doing damage well now wasnt Henry Hill responsible for several life sentences ? You say 13....13...13 to try to somehow not count associates in the mix when counting them well the number is doubled or more!...Associates are responsible for a vast array of crimes and bringing money in ....associates are in other words "PROSPECTIVE MEMBERS"....or are these associates in your eyes ....only privvy to crimes like jaywalking? Bosses have flipped....well now what else could you say ? and these arent run of the mill guys here we are talking about guys who knew EVERYTHING and EVERYONE going back decades. I believe every single murder attributed to the bonanos has been solved.The guy above was a reject a drug addict and a debase gambler YET HE WAS MADE. Now tell me their isnt a shortage of available men when they scrape the bottom of the barrel to fill their ranks with guys whom from even before being made were known to have drug addictions. Read between the lines its whats not said that is the loudest. Now would the LCN ever have considered a guy like that say --um ---15 years ago? Italian -Americans hold a couple of neighborhoods on the east coast....but outside NYC --their is not a single noteworthy Italian Neighborhood in th USA. Besonhurst-Staten Island......are whats left ....in the 5 burroughs. Even in the 1980s italian mafioso were complaining of a lack of italians to fill the void. So what are italians in America? They surely arent the ethnic group that was marganilized-ostracized-and viewed in the same light as jews or blacks.....they have almost completely been absorbed into the American mainstream...and only a few places on teh East Coast actually have any italians with any ties to their motherlands....No more homemade wine-zit--fresh baked bread. They are as much as Americans as any other white ethnic group.What are the figures of italian immigration? LOW ...I bet ....their arent calls from congress to stop the influx of italian criminals into American Society....Shouldnt the blatant disregard for omerta and carefully screening new members tell you that? Dont result to personal attacks because its unbecoming.....what would you know /as compared to the FBI-and census bureau. Haha.....I mean seriously guy .The italians had their day but and its a sad read seeing the amount of octagerians being rolled up..The last buts had guys no younger then 68 rolled up . I doubt thats for a lack of members(sarcasm)....

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Re: End of The Colombo and Bonano Families?

Unread post by Faciulina » July 27th, 2010, 9:53 am

Besonhurst-Staten Island......are whats left ....in the 5 burroughs... but outside NYC --their is not a single noteworthy Italian Neighborhood in th USA
you forgot troggs neck in the bronx, corona in queens and others, you forgot long island is 75% italians, westchester is full of italians and the new jersey is a big little italy

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Re: End of The Colombo and Bonano Families?

Unread post by thewestside » July 27th, 2010, 2:16 pm

mayugastank wrote:So what did I really say that was wrong here?
Well, let's see here.....



Mayugastank: “rats and snitches for the Bonannos are the majority”

Fact: To date there have been 13 made Bonanno members that have flipped. Average official estimates put the family at over 100 members total. 13 does not constitute a majority of 100+. Nor is the number of Bonanno associates that have flipped come close to the number that haven’t.

Mayugastank: “Dozens of unsolved murders and conspiracies were solved due to them”

Fact: Several murders were solved as a result of high-level members of the Bonanno family flipping. However, it doesn’t come close to dozens. The real damage came from Underboss Salvatore Vitale and some of the Captains that flipped, which helped to convict Boss Joe Massino. Massino decided to make a deal so that his family would be able to keep some of his money and so he could avoid a possible death sentence. But by that point, there was nothing Massino could give the government that his subordinates already hadn’t. So far, the only thing Massino has really done is get Acting Boss Vinny Basciano on tape talking about killing a judge.

Mayugastank: “75 Bonanno members have been convicted”

Fact: Over the past decade, over 70 Bonanno members and associates have been convicted or made plea deals. Not members alone.

Mayugastank: “The FBI has dismantled their Bonanno task force.”

Fact: In the early 1990’s the FBI combined the Bonanno and Colombo squads into one. But this resulted in the Bonannos growing in strength again, due to decreased scrutiny, and the government has had to address this over the past decade. Today each of the five New York families have their own, albeit smaller, FBI task force.

Mayugastank: “They have hardly any new members being made and those that do -end up testifying quite quickly.”

Fact: New members are routinely made for those that have died and the Bonannos have had at least 18 members die over the past decade. And none of the 13 members that have flipped have been newly made.

Mayugastank: “The entire leadership of the Bonannos turned states evidence”

Fact: Initially the Bonanno family’s Boss, Underboss, and 4 captains flipped. Later on some Acting Captains flipped as well. However, this did not constitute the entire leadership of the family, as there was still the Consigliere and several more captains. The positions of those that flipped, aside from the Boss and Underboss, have been filled and the family is currently being run by a ruling panel.

Mayugastank: “Since 2004 , almost every soldier convicted has turned states evidence”

Fact: 4 Bonanno Soldiers have flipped over the past decade. This doesn’t come close to the number that have been convicted and gone to prison.

Mayugastank: “The last Bonano bust had men in their 70s getting rolled up. There is no new blood.”

Fact: The average age for mob members in New York is late 60’s and early 70’s. This is nothing new. Most guys are not made until they are older. Yet there are still plenty of younger members and associates in their 30’s and 40’s.

Mayugastank: “No new recruits and hardly any Italian neighborhoods left.”

Fact: Once again, there are new recruits made every year. And while there are only a few distinctly Italian neighborhoods remaining, the mob in New York long ago evolved beyond being confined within neighbourhood boundaries. The Bonanno family alone operates in all five NYC buroughs, as well as Long Island, New Jersey, and Florida.

Mayguastank: “The italian mafia is dead due to a lack of italians!”

Fact: In places like San Francisco, San Jose, Denver, and New Orleans this is true. And basically true for other places like Los Angeles, Milwuakee, Kansas City, St. Louis, Cleveland, Tampa, and Pittsburgh. But the Italian Mafia is not dead in places like New York, New Jersey, New England, Philadelphia, Chicago, and Detroit.

Mayugastank: “Their isnt anything the FBI doesnt know about the bonanos going back to at least the 1970s.”

Fact: While the FBI has developed a great deal of in house knowledge on all the New York families over the past 30-40 years, there is still a lot they don’t know. Which is why investigations continue.

Mayugastank: “You throw out a 100 to make it sound good!”

Fact: You’re the one who pulls numbers out of his ass. I go by official estimates. Once again, average estimates of Bonanno membership by law enforcement is a little over 100.

Mayugastank: “But others like raab....quote say they are under 60...and going fast!”

Fact: Selwyn Raab has never said the Bonanno family has only 60 members left. He, as well as other journalists like Jerry Capeci, get their figures from the FBI. And they are all within the same general range. However, it is possible that a family like the Bonannos could have around 60 members active on the street, with the others being inactive or in prison.

Mayugastank: “The FBI has labeled then not an organized crime group....saying that it was a stretch to name a group of ragtag hoodlums a mafia.EXACT WORDS”

Fact: The FBI still considers the Bonanno family to be an organized crime group and one of the five Mafia families in New York. At this point, however, it is one of the smaller and weaker of the New York organizations. It doesn’t have the labor racketeering interests of the other New York families but is basically involved in the traditional mob rackets of gambling, loansharking, extortion, drug trafficking, fencing stolen goods, and fraud.

Mayugastank: “Now as for what constitutes the Bonanos in the last 2 decades its in complete disarray.”

Fact: The family has been severely weakened over the past decade but is not in disarray. Ongoing cases have shown it still has a formal leadership structure in place and continues to engage in ongoing organized crime activity.

Mayugastank: “YET you continue to inflate and create puffery to stretch 2 familys( GAMBINO-GENOVESE) into 5......”

Fact: Here’s a newsflash for you. There are 5 families in New York. Not 2. The Genovese and Gambino families are simply the two larger and more powerful ones. But that’s not to say the Lucchese, Colombo, and Bonanno families are gone.

Mayugastank: “Now tell me their isnt a shortage of available men when they scrape the bottom of the barrel to fill their ranks with guys whom from even before being made were known to have drug addictions. Read between the lines its whats not said that is the loudest. Now would the LCN ever have considered a guy like that say --um ---15 years ago?”

Fact: Nobody is denying there hasn’t been a general attrition of both quantity and quality in the mob. That’s been going on for the last 40 years. Where you go wrong is you belief that this has resulted in a family like the Bonannos coming to the point where they are almost dead. And that’s simply not true. The current hierarchy of the family and ongoing cases show as much.

Mayugastank: “Dont result to personal attacks because its unbecoming.....what would you know /as compared to the FBI-and census bureau. Haha.....I mean seriously guy.”

Fact: I’ve tried to be patient with you. But you have a history of reading one or two articles here or there and then coming on this forum and act like you know what you’re talking about. You post blatant falsehoods and half-truths, as well as misquote law enforcement officials and journalists. You pull figures out of thin air and come up with conclusions often based on assumptions. I’m the one who goes with what the FBI says, as well as pays attention to ongoing indictments. Face it pal, you are in over your head.

Mayugastank: “The last bust had guys no younger then 68 rolled up.”

Fact: The last Bonanno member indicted was Soldier Anthony Guarino (54). The last Genovese members indicted were former Acting Boss Artie Nigro (65) and Captain Felix Tranghese (55). The last Gambino members indicted were Soldiers Pietro Inzerillo (43) and Joseph Lanni (39). The last Colombo member indicted was Underboss Sonny Franzese (93). And the last Lucchese members indicted were Acting Bosses Joseph DiNapoli (74) and Matthew Madonna (74), Captains Ralph Perna (64) and Nicky Scarfo Jr. (44), and Soldiers Antonio Russo (73), John Perna (32), Joseph Perna (34), John Mangarella (67), and Martin Taccetta (57).

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Re: End of The Colombo and Bonano Families?

Unread post by mayugastank » July 28th, 2010, 2:41 am

Numbers Numbers .....The FBI said their were upwards of 300 mexican mafia members -but the 2 informers to ever turn say their are under 100 total from state-federal prisons and the streets!...Big differences there in their estimates and the true number. Now I guess you use what you have -which is brought by law enforcement but I bet an official debrief would give you a double view of what Law Enforcement says. They hype up numbers to get funding. The rizzuto clan in Canada was said to number in the hundreds range -but a debriefer said they numbered under 20.......big differences again. The Russian Mafia is said to be a autonnomous organization spreading from sea to sea YET the truth is they have no actual mafia. A notorious insurance cheat is now a MAFIA member-he'd replace car parts on insurance jobs with junk yard parts that he would repaint turn around and tell the insurance company that it was a new door-hood-fender.He and every Armenian autoshop were in on the racket ....the Feds got them turned around and labeled it a huge Eurasian/Russian mafia bust in LA.....yet not a one had a clue how to even say Mafia in english. But according to the LA times we now have a full scale Russian Mafia....with more power then any East Coast crime family. Its a hype! Look at whats not said .....1) The story above tells of how a notorious drug addicted -lopsided-construction dock worker became a mafia member.....he didnt even have to (whack) someone to get made. The Gambinos have had homosexual turncoats. Their 2 recent snitches Joey D Angelo and Mikey Scars.....both talked about a lack of money-throughout their mafia careers.Joey D...said he recieved a hamburger when he was made. John Gottis brother was never allowed to become a member -he was a well known drug abuser and debase gambler.....He eventually rose to the rank of Capo. Fat Pete Chiodo....was known as a bumbling idiot ....he eventually got a top spot in the lucchesse. Law enforcement and other mobsters were shocked at how quickly the guy rose. This was back in the day when the mafia was still pretty viable. The Lucchese-Bonano-Colombo families have been on the ropes for awhile....their was something I read that talked about disbanding the Bonanos at one point. Peter Gotti was known in mob circles as the dummy don. The list of informers is long and wide ....the bench is short and narrow....how else can it be explained. Could any of these guys I just named have ever amounted to a hill of beans in days past? Both the Colombos have had top tier guys flip continously....one after another. I read that arecent list had 1 guy getting his button-in the Colombos. Sure its been said before that the Mafia was on the ropes -but this time its more then likely true. Italy-Sicily....have a virtual army of willing recruits and a field longer then slots open-but hey its their homebase. If their wsnt a shortage of new blood would they have opened their doors to half-italian members/?

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Re: End of The Colombo and Bonano Families?

Unread post by thewestside » July 28th, 2010, 12:00 pm

I suppose I could go through your latest post and pick it apart again. But I will simply say you seem to come to a conclusion on the general state of the mob based on individual points of info. You have to look at the over all picture over an extended period of time to really get a good view of things.

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Re: End of The Colombo and Bonano Families?

Unread post by thewestside » July 28th, 2010, 5:09 pm

Ah, what the hell. I have a few minutes....


mayugastank wrote:Numbers Numbers .....The FBI said their were upwards of 300 mexican mafia members -but the 2 informers to ever turn say their are under 100 total from state-federal prisons and the streets!...Big differences there in their estimates and the true number. Now I guess you use what you have -which is brought by law enforcement but I bet an official debrief would give you a double view of what Law Enforcement says. They hype up numbers to get funding. The rizzuto clan in Canada was said to number in the hundreds range -but a debriefer said they numbered under 20.......big differences again.
Seems to me you are fine with what the FBI says when it supports your case. But if what they say doesn’t support you, you quickly dismiss their information as unreliable. And the fact that you’re trying to use a supposed inflated estimate of the Mexican Mafia as a basis to ignore official estimates of the Bonanno family’s size shows you’re grasping at straws. One minute you’re arguing there is nothing about the Bonanno family the FBI doesn’t know. The next minute you’re arguing they can’t even make a proper estimate of the family’s size. Do you realize how ridiculous you sound? Where do you think the FBI gets their info on mob membership? From turncoats and dry snitches. If anything, the FBI is more conservative about estimating membership because they, as a matter of practice, require two members to independently verify whether another is made. And for the record, Salvatore Vitale never said the Rizzutos had under 20 members. He said that 18-20 guys in the Rizzuto organization were also made members in the Bonanno family. It’s hard to make a solid argument when you don’t even have your basic facts right.
Look at whats not said .....1) The story above tells of how a notorious drug addicted -lopsided-construction dock worker became a mafia member.....he didnt even have to (whack) someone to get made.
First, as I’ve said before, nobody is denying there has been a big drop in terms of both quality and quantity in the mob. There are guys who get made now that would never have decades ago. But you can’t arrive at a general conclusion about the mob based on a few individual examples. Second, prospective members haven’t had to be involved in a hit for years now. That went out the window a long time ago.
The Gambinos have had homosexual turncoats.
If memory serves, they had one member flip who turned out to be gay – Robert Mormando. There was also an associate named Vito Arena who worked as a car thief for the DeMeo crew, who was gay. But even more to the point, it seems if you’re looking at the minority rather than the majority. The exceptions rather than the rule. You make it sound like most mob guys today, or even a lot of them, are drug-addicted homosexuals.
Their 2 recent snitches Joey D Angelo and Mikey Scars.....both talked about a lack of money-throughout their mafia careers.
D’Angelo was never a big earner. Mike Scars, however, rarely, if ever, lacked money. He made a lot of money from the construction rackets and from shakedowns of clubs and other businesses. Even more so when he became a captain. And they are not the most recent Gambino snitches.
John Gottis brother was never allowed to become a member -he was a well known drug abuser and debase gambler.....He eventually rose to the rank of Capo.
I assume you’re referring to Vincent Gotti. Despite his history of drugs and what not, he got made. Probably because he’s a Gotti more than anything. But he has never been a captain.
Fat Pete Chiodo....was known as a bumbling idiot ....he eventually got a top spot in the lucchesse.
Chiodo failed to carry out a hit in Florida that Casso had sent him to do but he made a lot of money from the windows installation scam and other rackets and eventually became a captain.
This was back in the day when the mafia was still pretty viable. The Lucchese-Bonano-Colombo families have been on the ropes for awhile
You might want to look up the definition of the word “viable.” Because the five New York families, though weakened, certainly still are viable. And while the three smaller New York families are don’t have the size or presence of the Genovese and Gambino families, they are at least twice the size of any family outside the city. People were saying they were “on the ropes” and “close to being a street gang” almost 20 years ago. Like I said before, it’s a slow process.
There something I read that the talked about disbanding Bonanos at one point
That was actually the Colombo family and the idea got brought up during a Commission meeting but was turned down for a few reasons, including it was simply impossible to merge the Colombos into the other families and it would be seen as a sign of disrespect to Carmine Persico. This came as a result of the family’s internal conflicts that had left them weakened. Somewhat similar to when the Bonanno family was kicked off the Commission for a number of years because of their internal conflicts.
The list of informers is long and wide ....the bench is short and narrow....how else can it be explained.
I’ve already explained this. You just don’t want to listen. On one hand, there has been dozens of mob members that have flipped over the past few decades. Including several high-ranking ones. And that’s to say nothing of associates. But on the other hand, even today they are still very much in the minority.
the Colombos have had top tier guys flip continously....one after another
You’re exaggerating again. In their entire history the Colombos have had 1 Consigliere, 3 captains, 2 acting captains, and 6 soldiers flip.
I read that arecent list had 1 guy getting his button-in the Colombos.
The number of guys made into a family at a given time isn’t always the same. It may be 1 guy, it may be 5 guys. Selwyn Raab mention in his book how the Colombos had recently made 10 new guys at one point. The numbers are controlled by only making guys to replace those that have died, plus 2 more at Christmas time.
If their wsnt a shortage of new blood would they have opened their doors to half-italian members/?

For a time, during the Gotti era, the New York families changed the rule so that a prospective member only had to have an Italian father. But this rule was supposedly changed back in the late 1990’s or early 2000’s. Of course, there will always be some of the more well-connected guys in New York and elsewhere who get made despite not being 100% Italian. But once again, they are more the exception than the rule.

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Re: End of The Colombo and Bonano Families?

Unread post by mayugastank » July 29th, 2010, 1:58 am

thewestside wrote:I suppose I could go through your latest post and pick it apart again. But I will simply say you seem to come to a conclusion on the general state of the mob based on individual points of info. You have to look at the over all picture over an extended period of time to really get a good view of things.

Granted and noted. But what I have been reading has not been the best for giving grades on strength. It just seems an impossibility that they could ever come back from some of those informers.. Every General knows that loss of morale is the deadliest weapon. Bosses snitching is a death blow to morale. From what I have seen when captains or bosses flip/its usually a chain reaction. Many mafioso talk about the loss of enthusiasm for that life. Yet before-the number of informers reached a fever pitch -guys like Gene Gotti and John Carneglia were willing and ready to say goodbye to a lifetime in belief of omerta and the family. It held as much mystic as any brotherhood known to man. They were willing to kill and die for it. Look at Sonny Black and Lefty Ruggiero whom walked right into their deaths without a thought -of ever informing. Now the situation is a ruckus. And thats a general conclusion from alot of what I read. Do you have a timeline or anything on when these guys flipped? because I read that -the bonanos had never had an informer up until at least the late 90s.

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Re: End of The Colombo and Bonano Families?

Unread post by thewestside » July 29th, 2010, 3:06 pm

mayugastank wrote:Granted and noted. But what I have been reading has not been the best for giving grades on strength. It just seems an impossibility that they could ever come back from some of those informers.. Every General knows that loss of morale is the deadliest weapon. Bosses snitching is a death blow to morale. From what I have seen when captains or bosses flip/its usually a chain reaction. Many mafioso talk about the loss of enthusiasm for that life. Yet before-the number of informers reached a fever pitch -guys like Gene Gotti and John Carneglia were willing and ready to say goodbye to a lifetime in belief of omerta and the family. It held as much mystic as any brotherhood known to man. They were willing to kill and die for it. Look at Sonny Black and Lefty Ruggiero whom walked right into their deaths without a thought -of ever informing. Now the situation is a ruckus. And thats a general conclusion from alot of what I read.
I think the mistake some people make is making a direct comparison between the mob at it's peak in the 1950's and 1960's and the mob today, which obviously shows a major contrast. What they need to do is recognize the gradual decline of the mob over the years and decades from then till now. They'll see it's been a slow process and many of the predictions of the mob's demise, at least in New York and some other areas, have been premature. And they'll see that none of the New York families will be going away any time soon. They are chipped away bit by bit, getting weaker as time goes by.
Do you have a timeline or anything on when these guys flipped? because I read that -the bonanos had never had an informer up until at least the late 90s.
There's somewhat of a difference between a guy who is just informing or feeding law enforcement information (called a dry snitch) while still being involved in the mob and a guy who publically flips, quits the life, and comes under the government's protection so he can testify at trial. There's been secret informers more or less since the beginning. The ones that eventually became known are also listed below. But most of the list are guys who publically turned state's witness.


Bonanno Family

1. Captain Frank Coppa – 2002
2. Acting Underboss Richard “Shellackhead” Cantarella – 2003
3. Soldier Paul Cantarella - 2003
4. Captain James “Big Lou” Tartaglione – 2003
5. Captain Frank “Curly” Lino – 2003
6. Underboss Salvatore “Good Looking Sal” Vitale – 2003
7. Soldier Joseph “Joey Mook” D’Amico – 2003
8. Boss Joseph “Big Joey” Massino – 2004
9. Acting Captain Dominick Cicale – 2006
10. Acting Captain Nicholas “PJ” Pisciotti – 2007
11. Soldier Generoso “Jimmy the General” Barbieri – last 5 years
12. Soldier Michael “Sonny” Maggio – last 5 years
13. Unidentified Soldier - last few years


Colombo Family

1. Captain Gregory Scarpa Sr. – 1993 (informant since late 1950’s)
2. Acting Captain Michael Franzese - 1986
3. Captain John Pate – 1993
4. Acting Captain Salvatore “Big Sal” Misciotta – 1993
5. Soldier Alan Quatrache – 1993
6. Consigliere Carmine Sessa – 1993
7. Soldier Rocco Cagno – early 2000’s
8. Soldier Joseph “Joe Camp” Campanella – 2003
9. Soldier Joseph “Joey Caves” Compatiello – 2009
10. Soldier Frank “Frankie Blue Eyes” Sparaco – 2010
11. Captain Dino “Big Dino” Calabro – 2010


Lucchese Family

1. Soldier Dominick “The Gap” Petrilli – informant in the early 1940’s (killed)
2. Soldier Eugenio “Gene” Giannini – informant in 1950’s
3. Acting Boss Alphonse “Little Al” D’Arco – 1991
4. Soldier Joseph D’Arco – 1991
5. Captain Peter “Fat Pete” Chiodo – 1992
6. Soldier Thomas Ricciardi – 1993
7. Soldier Frank “Goo Goo” Suppa – 1993
8. Captain Anthony “Tumac” Accetturo - 1993
9. Underboss Anthony “Gaspipe” Casso – 1994
10. Soldier Frank Gioia Sr. – 1995
11. Soldier Frank Gioia Jr. – 1995
12. Acting Boss Joseph “Little Joe” DeFede – 2003
13. Soldier Vincent “Vinny Baldy” Salanardi – 2004


Gambino Family

1. Soldier Alfonse “Jim Carra” Attardi – informant in 1940’s and 1950’s
2. Underboss Salvatore “Sammy the Bull” Gravano – 1991
3. Soldier Dominick “Fat Dom” Borghese – 1998
4. Soldier Craig DePalma – 2001
5. Captain Michael “Mikey Scars” DiLeonardo – 2003
6. Soldier Frank “Frankie Fap” Fappiano – 2004
7. Soldier Primo Cassarino – 2005
8. Soldier Joseph “Little Joe” D’Angelo – 2005
9. Soldier Robert Mormando – 2009
10. Unidentified Soldier – last few years


Genovese Family

1. Soldier Joseph “Joe Cargo” Valachi – 1963
2. Soldier Fiore “Fury” Siano – informant in 1960’s (killed)
3. Captain John “Futto” Biello – informant in 1960’s (killed)
4. Soldier Vincent “Fish” Cafaro – 1986
5. Soldier George Barone – 2003
6. Soldier Anthony “Bingy” Arillotta - 2010

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Re: End of The Colombo and Bonano Families?

Unread post by mayugastank » July 30th, 2010, 1:49 am

The bonanos went from their beginings till 2003 without an informer. Wow. They sure did make up for it real quick. Its not a wonder that theyd be written off. The list of top tier guys who have broke -is high. Some of the things you say I cant seem to find anywhere. Where did you get that a mafioso who informs can never be replaced? Also you forgot to add the Micheal Souza to the list of Colombos who have flipped.

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Re: End of The Colombo and Bonano Families?

Unread post by mayugastank » July 30th, 2010, 2:08 am

In 2009 the F.B.I. believed that Coppola was going to turn state's evidence against the Genovese family and cooperate with the F.B.I.[8] The F.B.I. was willing to give him immunity from prosecution and enter him in the Witness Protection Program if he cooperated. The F.B.I. believed he was involved in the killing of Lawrence Ricci on the orders of Tino Fiumara, one of the men the F.B.I. was hoping to prosecute with Coppola's cooperation.[8] Coppola waived a speedy arraignment and spent the next two nights sleeping at F.B.I. headquarters in lower Manhattan at an undisclosed hotel. He also met with a government arranged lawyer known as a "shadow counsel". On the third day however, Coppola refused to cooperate. His defense lawyer Henry Mazurek said that Coppola only dragged out the process in concern for his wife, who he feared would also be arrested and charged.[8]

In July 2009 he was put on trial for racketeering charges in the murder of John "Johnny Cokes" Lardiere and for extorting the Local 1235 of the International Longshoremen's Association for over 30 years.[12] If found guilty of all counts, he could have faced life imprisonment. Defense lawyer Henry Mazurek told jurors that Coppola admitted to making a "rash" decision to flee, but that it didn't prove he's a killer. "He didn't want to stand trial for a murder he didn't commit," Mazurek said.[13] Assistant U.S. Attorney Jack Dennehy told the jury not to be fooled by Coppola's claims and that Coppola "ran because he didn't want to face a jury like you. He hid because he didn't want to face a jury like you"[14] Thomas Riccardi testified that Coppola said he did not agree with the Lardiere murder, but that he followed the orders given to him by Tino Fiumara (who was never charged).[15] Genovese family member turned government witness George Barone was also called to aid the prosecution. Barone was such a handful as a witness that the prosecutor apparently decided it wasn't worth the risk asking him about the murder of Lardiere.[16]

A witness to the murder, Raymond Zychlinski, was called on as a defense witness in the case.[17] Zychlinski refuted the prosecutor's story that Lardiere's killer taunted him and said all he heard was a "horrifying scream".[18] On July 21, 2009 Coppola was acquitted of the murder,[12] partially due to the D.N.A. test proving inconclusive since it matched 11 million white men in America. However, he was found guilty of violating the RICO Act for extortion and possessing false identification while he was a fugitive, which could have imprisoned him for up to 20 years.[12] Coppola nodded and mouthed the words, "It's O.K.," to his wife after the verdict.[19] He was then taken into custody already serving time for his original fugitive sentence in the Metropolitan Detention Center, Brooklyn.[20] On December 18, 2009 Judge John Gleeson sentenced Coppola to 16 years in prison.[12] His projected release date is March 4, 2024.[21]





THIS ALSO SEEMS VERY UNLIKELY .

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Re: End of The Colombo and Bonano Families?

Unread post by thewestside » July 31st, 2010, 12:03 am

mayugastank wrote:The bonanos went from their beginings till 2003 without an informer. Wow. They sure did make up for it real quick. Its not a wonder that theyd be written off. The list of top tier guys who have broke -is high.


Once again, you have to differentiate between an "informer" and a guy who officially flips. Valachi was the first member to officially flip, in 1963. But there had, no doubt, been various informers in all the families; i.e. guys feeding info to the feds and cops previously. It's a little ironic that the first made guy to flip was from the Genovese family, which has long been considered to be the most tight knit, secretive, and disciplined family. It might very well be Valachi turning and going on national television to talk about the Mafia caused the Genovese to become that way to an even greater degree in later years. On the other hand you had the Bonannos, which many considered to be one of the most chaotic families in New York, not have a member officially flip until Frank Coppa in 2002. But once that happened, it started a domino effect of several top guys turning; all the way up to the Boss himself.
Some of the things you say I cant seem to find anywhere. Where did you get that a mafioso who informs can never be replaced?


In order to keep a relative balance between the families in New York, and not allow a family to make too many guys or ones that don't past muster, typically guys are only made for those that have died. Plus, as I said before, traditionally two more at Christmas. When a family is about to make new members, they have to pass a list of their names around to the other families to make sure there are no problems. A family isn't allowed to replace a guy that flips because that's basically seen as their fault and they don't deserve to fill that position. But there's ways to get around that, including simply making up a name of a member that has just died in order to make someone else.
Also you forgot to add the Micheal Souza to the list of Colombos who have flipped.
You're right, he flipped last year. He was a soldier.
THIS ALSO SEEMS VERY UNLIKELY .
I have a hard time believing a guy like Mikey Cigars ever really contemplated flipping. But I'm always dubious when we're talking about someone in the Genovese family. Especially an old school gangster like Coppola.

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Re: End of The Colombo and Bonano Families?

Unread post by mayugastank » August 12th, 2010, 8:36 pm

.JUDGE SENTENCES 8 MAFIA LEADERS TO PRISON TERMS
By ARNOLD H. LUBASCH
Published: January 14, 1987
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. .Prison sentences of 40 to 100 years were imposed yesterday on eight men convicted as top leaders and key associates of the ''commission'' that ruled the Mafia in the United States.

In imposing the stringent sentences in a crowded courtroom of Federal District Court in Manhattan, Judge Richard Owen castigated the defendants as ruthless racketeers who operated the Mafia's ''board of directors.''

Judge Owen gave 100-year sentences to seven defendants convicted of numerous charges and a 40-year sentence to the other defendant, who was convicted of two charges that carried a maximum of 20 years each. 'Prejudiced From the First Day'

Among those receiving 100-year sentences were three men convicted as the bosses of major Mafia families - Anthony (Fat Tony) Salerno, 75 years old, of the Genovese group, Anthony (Tony Ducks) Corallo, 73, of the Lucchese group and Carmine (Junior) Persico, 53, of the Colombo group.

Mr. Persico, who served as his own lawyer, told the judge that the defendants had been deprived of a fair trial because of ''this Mafia mania that was flying around.''

''This case was prejudiced from the first day,'' Mr. Persico said, complaining about publicity the case received. He urged the judge to focus on a defense accusation of prosecutorial misconduct instead of trying to ''satisfy the public that he's sending Mafia people to jail for 100 years.'' Murder, Extortion and Payoffs

Judge Owen, who also imposed maximum fines of $50,000 to $250,000, noted that the defendants would be eligible for parole after 10 years under Federal law, but he recommended that they be denied parole.

The defendants were convicted Nov. 19 of conducting the affairs of ''the commission of La Cosa Nostra'' in a racketeering pattern that included murders, loan-sharking, labor payoffs and extortion in the concrete industry in New York City.

The one defendant sentenced to 40 years was Anthony (Bruno) Indelicato, 39, a member of the Bonanno family. He was convicted of taking part in the 1979 murder of the family's boss, Carmine Galante, and two associates. A Light Moment

Another defendant, Gennaro (Gerry Lang) Langella, 48, was convicted as Mr. Persico's second-in-command in the Colombo family. Last November, both men were sentenced in a different racketeering case, with prison terms of 39 years for Mr. Persico and 65 years for Mr. Langella.

In one of the few light moments at the sentencing yesterday, a defense lawyer, Frank A. Lopez, told the judge that Mr. Langella was already serving such a long sentence that he could not give much more time to his country.

The comment drew a smile from Judge Owen, who said Mr. Persico and Mr. Langella could serve the sentences concurrently.

Another defendant sentenced as a member of the Colombo family in the commission case was Ralph Scopo, 58, a former president of the District Council of Cement and Concrete Workers.

Two others, Salvatore (Tom Mix) Santoro, 72, and Christopher (Christie Tick) Furnari, 62, were sentenced as the Lucchese underboss and counselor, respectively. 'You're Doing a Good Job'

Directing sarcastic remarks at the judge, Mr. Santoro said as he was being sentenced, ''You're in the driver's seat, Your Honor.''

When the judge said he was just doing his job, Mr. Santoro retorted bitterly, ''And you're doing a good job.''

For the most part, however, the defendants displayed little emotion as the judge announced the sentences in the hushed courtroom. Defense lawyers said they would appeal the convictions.

Each of the main charges carried a maximum 20-year sentence, which could have amounted to 300 years for most of the defendants. The judge imposed the maximum for most of the charges, but he made some of the terms concurrent.

Addressing Mr. Salerno as the sentencing began, the judge said, ''You have essentially spent a lifetime terrorizing this community to your financial advantage.''

Mr. Indelicato and Mr. Scopo were convicted of carrying out orders of the commission leaders. Mr. Indelicato was the only one named in murders authorized by the commission.

According to a 58-page sentencing memorandum by the prosecutors, Michael Chertoff, John F. Savarese and John Gilmore Childers, the trial showed that the commission was ''the national ruling body of La Cosa Nostra, or the Mafia, in the United States.''

The prosecutors said the commission coordinated criminal activities, resolved disputes and sometimes ordered ''the execution of family bosses.'' Team Effort Praised

After the sentencing, United States Attorney Rudolph W. Giuliani conducted a news conference at his Manhattan office with Federal, state and local law-enforcement officials who praised the team effort in the case.

Mr. Giuliani said the defendants ''richly deserved'' long sentences.

Some bosses, including Mr. Persico, have previously run Mafia families from prison by using trusted aides and couriers, according to the authorities. They said the convicted commission leaders had already appointed acting bosses and were unlikely to retain power, particularly in light of their long sentences.

The commission case and other recent convictions have been described by the authorities as devastating blows that could create turmoil in the Mafia and make it more dangerous for new leaders to run the organization.

Besides the men convicted in the trial, two other bosses were originally charged in the case. They were Paul Castellano of the Gambino group, who was killed in 1985, and Philip Rastelli of the Bonanno group, who was convicted in a separate case last year.

John Gotti, accused of being the new Gambino boss, is a defendant in a racketeering trial in Brooklyn.

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Re: End of The Colombo and Bonano Families?

Unread post by mayugastank » August 12th, 2010, 8:40 pm

The above post is a far cry from what the mafia is now. Imagine a trial where 10 mafia defendants recieve effectively life terms without one even considering flipping. There was only one made man during that entire trial who would testify. Bruno Indelicato...was offered freedom right on the spot if he would testify-they figured he'd be easy to flip considering his father had just been killed. Yet they were wrong. Now adays any mob trial has just as many rats as defendants. Its a sad day -for an organization that for all its fault held loyalty and honor as real life commandments.

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Re: End of The Colombo and Bonano Families?

Unread post by juventus » August 13th, 2010, 2:29 am

however there is a big difference between plead deals and actually flipping...

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Re: End of The Colombo and Bonano Families?

Unread post by thewestside » August 14th, 2010, 12:17 am

mayugastank wrote:Now adays any mob trial has just as many rats as defendants.
False.
juventus wrote:however there is a big difference between plead deals and actually flipping...
True. Plea deals are the usual nowadays. Pleading out can get guys 4 or 5 years when they might get 20+ years if convicted. Gotti never believed in plea bargaining though. And he forbade his guys to do it too. Which is why many of them are still rotting away in prison. Like his brother Gene, for instance. He'd be out by now if he had take a plea deal.

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Re: End of The Colombo and Bonano Families?

Unread post by juventus » August 14th, 2010, 5:54 am

thewestside wrote:
mayugastank wrote:Now adays any mob trial has just as many rats as defendants.
False.
juventus wrote:however there is a big difference between plead deals and actually flipping...
True. Plea deals are the usual nowadays. Pleading out can get guys 4 or 5 years when they might get 20+ years if convicted. Gotti never believed in plea bargaining though. And he forbade his guys to do it too. Which is why many of them are still rotting away in prison. Like his brother Gene, for instance. He'd be out by now if he had take a plea deal.
this is what we call lack of vision...
btw: westside, would you agree if someone said "we can't really say the mob is in decline last couple of years. its actually stabilising ..."?

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Re: End of The Colombo and Bonano Families?

Unread post by thewestside » August 15th, 2010, 12:55 am

juventus wrote:btw: westside, would you agree if someone said "we can't really say the mob is in decline last couple of years. its actually stabilising ..."?
Generally speaking, the mob has been in a gradual decline for the last 30-40 years as a result of any number of factors, including general attrition, law enforcement investigations, informants, labor union reform, etc. While there were once over two dozen families nationwide, now there are 9 or 10 formally structured, viable ones remaining. Individually speaking, certain families have stabilized for a time in the short term but the long term general decline continues. I think the last family to make a resurgence was the Bonannos during the 1990's and that was only because the FBI diverted a lot of resources from invesigating them. Even the Genovese family, the most powerful in the country, has declined from where it once was. It simply has declined less than the others.

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Re: End of The Colombo and Bonano Families?

Unread post by juventus » August 15th, 2010, 8:57 am

Bonanno Family

1. Captain Frank Coppa – 2002
2. Acting Underboss Richard “Shellackhead” Cantarella – 2003
3. Soldier Paul Cantarella - 2003
4. Captain James “Big Lou” Tartaglione – 2003
5. Captain Frank “Curly” Lino – 2003
6. Underboss Salvatore “Good Looking Sal” Vitale – 2003
7. Soldier Joseph “Joey Mook” D’Amico – 2003
8. Boss Joseph “Big Joey” Massino – 2004
9. Acting Captain Dominick Cicale – 2006
10. Acting Captain Nicholas “PJ” Pisciotti – 2007
11. Soldier Generoso “Jimmy the General” Barbieri – last 5 years
12. Soldier Michael “Sonny” Maggio – last 5 years
13. Unidentified Soldier - last few years


Colombo Family

1. Captain Gregory Scarpa Sr. – 1993 (informant since late 1950’s)
2. Acting Captain Michael Franzese - 1986
3. Captain John Pate – 1993
4. Acting Captain Salvatore “Big Sal” Misciotta – 1993
5. Soldier Alan Quatrache – 1993
6. Consigliere Carmine Sessa – 1993
7. Soldier Rocco Cagno – early 2000’s
8. Soldier Joseph “Joe Camp” Campanella – 2003
9. Soldier Joseph “Joey Caves” Compatiello – 2009
10. Soldier Frank “Frankie Blue Eyes” Sparaco – 2010
11. Captain Dino “Big Dino” Calabro – 2010


Lucchese Family

1. Soldier Dominick “The Gap” Petrilli – informant in the early 1940’s (killed)
2. Soldier Eugenio “Gene” Giannini – informant in 1950’s
3. Acting Boss Alphonse “Little Al” D’Arco – 1991
4. Soldier Joseph D’Arco – 1991
5. Captain Peter “Fat Pete” Chiodo – 1992
6. Soldier Thomas Ricciardi – 1993
7. Soldier Frank “Goo Goo” Suppa – 1993
8. Captain Anthony “Tumac” Accetturo - 1993
9. Underboss Anthony “Gaspipe” Casso – 1994
10. Soldier Frank Gioia Sr. – 1995
11. Soldier Frank Gioia Jr. – 1995
12. Acting Boss Joseph “Little Joe” DeFede – 2003
13. Soldier Vincent “Vinny Baldy” Salanardi – 2004


Gambino Family

1. Soldier Alfonse “Jim Carra” Attardi – informant in 1940’s and 1950’s
2. Underboss Salvatore “Sammy the Bull” Gravano – 1991
3. Soldier Dominick “Fat Dom” Borghese – 1998
4. Soldier Craig DePalma – 2001
5. Captain Michael “Mikey Scars” DiLeonardo – 2003
6. Soldier Frank “Frankie Fap” Fappiano – 2004
7. Soldier Primo Cassarino – 2005
8. Soldier Joseph “Little Joe” D’Angelo – 2005
9. Soldier Robert Mormando – 2009
10. Unidentified Soldier – last few years


Genovese Family

1. Soldier Joseph “Joe Cargo” Valachi – 1963
2. Soldier Fiore “Fury” Siano – informant in 1960’s (killed)
3. Captain John “Futto” Biello – informant in 1960’s (killed)
4. Soldier Vincent “Fish” Cafaro – 1986
5. Soldier George Barone – 2003
6. Soldier Anthony “Bingy” Arillotta - 2010
do you have a list of guys who have flipped from other families ( decavalcante's, patriarca, scarfo, chicago outfit or the detroit partnership)?
does the fbi put the same amount of recources and manpower to investigate these minor families as they do on the five families?

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Re: End of The Colombo and Bonano Families?

Unread post by thewestside » August 15th, 2010, 9:55 pm

juventus wrote:do you have a list of guys who have flipped from other families ( decavalcante's, patriarca, scarfo, chicago outfit or the detroit partnership)?
New England:
1. Boss Frank "Cadillac Frank" Salemme
2. Soldier Angelo "Sonny" Mercurio
3. Soldier John "Sonny" Castagna
4. Soldier Gaetano Milano
5. Soldier Antonio "Nino" Cucinotta
6. Soldier Robert Danato

New Jersey:
1. Acting Boss Vincent "Vinnie Ocean" Palermo
2. Captain Anthony Rotondo
3. Soldier Anthony Capo

Philadelphia:
1. Boss Ralph Natale
2. Underboss Philip "Crazy Phil" Leonetti
3. Captain Peter "The Crumb" Caprio
4. Captain Ronald "Big Ron" Previte
5. Captain Robert "Bobby" Luise Jr.
6. Captain George Freselone
7. Soldier Thomas "Tommy Del" DelGiorno
8. Soldier Lawrence "Larry" Merlino
9. Soldier Nicholas "Nicky the Crow" Caramandi
10. Soldier Eugene "Gino" Milano
11. Soldier Salvatore "Wayne" Grande
12. Soldier Biagio Adornetto
13. Soldier Rosario Bellochi
14. Soldier Sergio Battaglia
15. Soldier John Veasey
16. Soldier Gaetono "Tommy Horsehead" Scafidi

Buffalo:
1. Captain Albert Marone
2. Soldier Pasquale "Patty" Calabrese
3. Soldier Vito Aueci

Rochester:
1. Soldier Anthony DeCanzio
2. Soldier Joseph "Spike" LaNovara
3. Soldier Angelo Monachino
4. Soldier Anthony Oliveri

Chicago:
1. Soldier Nicholas Calabrese

Pittsburgh:
1. Underboss Charles "Chuckie" Porter
2. Captain Leonard "Lenny" Strollo

Detroit:
1. Soldier Nove Tocco

Cleveland:
1. Underboss Angelo "Big Ange" Lonardo
2. Soldier John "Curly" Montana

Kansas City:
1. Soldier Joe Agosto

St. Louis:
1. Acting Boss John Vitale

Tampa:
1. Soldier John Mamone

San Jose:
1. Soldier Orlando Catelli

Los Angeles:
1. Acting Boss Aladene "Jimmy the Weasal" Fratiano
2. Captain Louis "Tom" Dragna
3. Consigliere Frank "The Bomp" Bompensiero
4. Soldier Salvatore "Dago Louie" Piscopo
5. Soldier Anthony Fiato
does the fbi put the same amount of recources and manpower to investigate these minor families as they do on the five families?
Not even close. A decade ago a UN report on La Cosa Nostra stated that, while mob investigations remained a high priority in New York, they were a low priority elsewhere in the country. In New York you don't just have five families, as opposed to only one elsewhere. You have the five largest, most diversified, most active, and most expansive families. Where you have over 700 members in New York, you have 50, 25, 10, etc. in other cities. To put it another way, the smallest New York family is at least twice the size of any family outside the city. Of course, that's not to say there is not still ongoing investigations and prosecutions of mob families in Chicago, New England, New Jersey, Philadelphia, and once in a while, other places. But even all of them combined don't equal those in New York.

I should also point out that law enforcement resources against the New York families are not what they once were. During the 1980's and 1990's, there were 350 FBI agents working full or part time on mob cases. Plus an additional 100 OC detectives from the NYPD. Much of that manpower was diverted to terrorism after 9/11. Today there are only about 50 FBI agents working mob cases in New York. 12 for the Genovese family, plus some detectives. 12 for the Gambino family. and less than 10 each for the Lucchese, Colombo, and Bonanno families. Some have expressed concern that the reduced scrutiny can only help the mob in New York recover. And that's certainly a possibility, at least to some extent. But so far, the amount of indictments against the five families don't seem to have let up over the last decade. And at this point, the government doesn't need the same amount of resources devoted to the mob that it did decades ago. With the five families, indictments simply chip away at them, while general attrition will be what ultimately does them in.

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Re: End of The Colombo and Bonano Families?

Unread post by juventus » August 16th, 2010, 9:29 am

Thanks Westside, I've been reading your posts for a while. not becoming a forum member yet, mainly because of most of the topics resulting in some whining by some of the other members(wont mentiong any names :wink: ). Just wanted to say i respect your knowledge and am grathfull you take the time to answer my questions). PM me is you want to:.

Btw came to some interesting conclussions ebcause of the list. however a few things aren't clear yet.
Like the Detroit, New Jersey and Chicago families really have a miminum amount of members flipping over the years. Is there any particular reason for this?

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Re: End of The Colombo and Bonano Families?

Unread post by thewestside » August 16th, 2010, 10:20 pm

juventus wrote:Btw came to some interesting conclussions ebcause of the list. however a few things aren't clear yet.
Like the Detroit, New Jersey and Chicago families really have a miminum amount of members flipping over the years. Is there any particular reason for this?
Obviously we can only go by known members who have flipped. It's probable that most families have had secret informants over the years. It's also important to take into account the relative size of the families. A family with over 100 members, just because of size, is probably going to have more guys flip than a family with only 20 members. It's better to look at the ratio of guys who have flipped to the over all size of the family, in my opinion.

Beyond that, the Chicago Outfit has always been a very secretive mob family. In terms of discipline, they are comparable to the Genovese family. They've had several associates flip over the years but it appears Calabrese was the first known made member to do so. Detroit has always been a smaller and rather tight-knit family with many of the members being related by blood. If you look at any recent Detroit chart, you see a lot of the same names - Toccos, Giacalones, Palazzolas, Corrados, etc. The Decavalcante family has also been a smaller family with, at least traditionally, many of it's members being related or their ancestors from the town of Ribera in Sicily.

What's interesting is that the family which is widely considered to be the most secretive and disciplined, the Genovese family, had the first known made member to flip - Joe Valachi in 1963. On the other hand, one of the New York families that has always been seen as rather chaotic, the Bonanno family, didn't have any known members flip until 2002. But this shouldn't mislead anyone. The few times a Genovese guy has flipped, it's been a rare and isolated case. Whereas the Bonannos, like the rest of the New York families, have had several guys flip in rather quick succession.

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Re: End of The Colombo and Bonano Families?

Unread post by thewestside » August 16th, 2010, 10:30 pm

juventus wrote: PM me is you want to
By the way, I sent you a PM.

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